Awful news and was just on that particular stretch of road a couple of weeks ago when travelling from France to Genoa. Remember being surprised how many road bridges there were going into the city in a complex road system. Hope that this tragedy isn't as bad as feared.
Jesus. Just came out of a meeting to see an email from my wife entitled Panic! Our kids are in Genoa at the moment with their step-grand parents. Thankfully they, the family and friends are not involved in any way. Phew. That’s incredible, like something out of a disaster movie!
Absolutely horrific. RIP to the people who lost their lives.
Some people will have witnessed an unimaginably gruesome scene. It will take much longer for some witnesses to rebuild their lives than for the bridge to be replaced.
if seems as if this tragedy is already being used as a political tool against the EU.
Deputy Premier Matteo Salvini claims the deadly collapse of a bridge is the fault of EU budget constraints. that the deficit is jeopardising infrastructure repairs.
“We should ask ourselves whether respecting these [fiscal] limits is more important than the safety of Italian citizens. Obviously for me it is not,”
“We should ask ourselves whether respecting these [fiscal] limits is more important than the safety of Italian citizens. Obviously for me it is not,”
I am sorry, but yes the fiscal limits should be kept. One could make this exact same case for almost every single cause. Healthcare. Infrastructure. Homeless. Poverty Programs. Refugees. Education. Everyone can name multiple causes that one could say theoretically is "more important that fiscal responsibility."
I agree that this is an issue, and it is in almost every country, but no-limit spending to supposedly reduce suffering will just turn Italy and Spain and other such countries into Turkey, Venezuela and the like. Better to cut spending in other areas and re-direct it to infrastructure. Deficit spending is just kicking the can down to the next generation. People need to be willing to make difficult choices. Debt is not free.
“We should ask ourselves whether respecting these [fiscal] limits is more important than the safety of Italian citizens. Obviously for me it is not,”
I am sorry, but yes the fiscal limits should be kept. One could make this exact same case for almost every single cause. Healthcare. Infrastructure. Homeless. Poverty Programs. Refugees. Education. Everyone can name multiple causes that one could say theoretically is "more important that fiscal responsibility."
I agree that this is an issue, and it is in almost every country, but no-limit spending to supposedly reduce suffering will just turn Italy and Spain and other such countries into Turkey, Venezuela and the like. Better to cut spending in other areas and re-direct it to infrastructure. Deficit spending is just kicking the can down to the next generation. People need to be willing to make difficult choices.
I think he is saying that essential infrastructure is not being repaired or properly maintained - because there is no money to do so.
He is also saying there is no money because of EU fiscal limits.
“We should ask ourselves whether respecting these [fiscal] limits is more important than the safety of Italian citizens. Obviously for me it is not,”
I am sorry, but yes the fiscal limits should be kept. One could make this exact same case for almost every single cause. Healthcare. Infrastructure. Homeless. Poverty Programs. Refugees. Education. Everyone can name multiple causes that one could say theoretically is "more important that fiscal responsibility."
I agree that this is an issue, and it is in almost every country, but no-limit spending to supposedly reduce suffering will just turn Italy and Spain and other such countries into Turkey, Venezuela and the like. Better to cut spending in other areas and re-direct it to infrastructure. Deficit spending is just kicking the can down to the next generation. People need to be willing to make difficult choices.
I think he is saying that essential infrastructure is not being repaired or properly maintained - because there is no money to do so.
He is also saying there is no money because of EU fiscal limits.
I know what he is saying. Fiscal limits are there for a reason. To me it is absurd that the world operates in a manner where every country runs a permanent deficit every year, building up debt levels that will eventually take down the global economy. And that trying to put even a CAP on deficits is somehow considered austerity. When a family continually spends more than it makes, it is considered irresponsible. When countries do it, it is considered somehow good.
Anyone wanna show me how the following is sustainable?
“We should ask ourselves whether respecting these [fiscal] limits is more important than the safety of Italian citizens. Obviously for me it is not,”
I am sorry, but yes the fiscal limits should be kept. One could make this exact same case for almost every single cause. Healthcare. Infrastructure. Homeless. Poverty Programs. Refugees. Education. Everyone can name multiple causes that one could say theoretically is "more important that fiscal responsibility."
I agree that this is an issue, and it is in almost every country, but no-limit spending to supposedly reduce suffering will just turn Italy and Spain and other such countries into Turkey, Venezuela and the like. Better to cut spending in other areas and re-direct it to infrastructure. Deficit spending is just kicking the can down to the next generation. People need to be willing to make difficult choices.
I think he is saying that essential infrastructure is not being repaired or properly maintained - because there is no money to do so.
He is also saying there is no money because of EU fiscal limits.
Not so sure the EU is to blame for shoddy infrastructure. It's actually one of the things they do spend money on, even though they tend to use it in a rather distasteful 'carrot and stick' fashion, like recent threats over funding for EU27 nations to get in line over Brexit.
Some of the people at work were speaking with one of our clients in Genoa a couple of weeks ago. It would seem the biggest problem with infrastructure projects there is the corruption and criminality surrounding the construction industry. Whatever the government are paying for civil works, large chunks of it are getting 'diverted' and the jobs are being finished on the cheap and substandard.
“We should ask ourselves whether respecting these [fiscal] limits is more important than the safety of Italian citizens. Obviously for me it is not,”
I am sorry, but yes the fiscal limits should be kept. One could make this exact same case for almost every single cause. Healthcare. Infrastructure. Homeless. Poverty Programs. Refugees. Education. Everyone can name multiple causes that one could say theoretically is "more important that fiscal responsibility."
I agree that this is an issue, and it is in almost every country, but no-limit spending to supposedly reduce suffering will just turn Italy and Spain and other such countries into Turkey, Venezuela and the like. Better to cut spending in other areas and re-direct it to infrastructure. Deficit spending is just kicking the can down to the next generation. People need to be willing to make difficult choices.
I think he is saying that essential infrastructure is not being repaired or properly maintained - because there is no money to do so.
He is also saying there is no money because of EU fiscal limits.
Some of the people at work were speaking with one of our clients in Genoa a couple of weeks ago. It would seem the biggest problem with infrastructure projects there is the corruption and criminality surrounding the construction industry. Whatever the government are paying for civil works, large chunks of it are getting 'diverted' and the jobs are being finished on the cheap and substandard.
It's ever been thus. Not just in Italy - but luckily that sort of thing doesn't happen in Britain.
Side note... anyone know why so much cement was used in that bridge? Seems like an awfully heavy way of making a bridge.
Concrete doesn't perform in tension so the cables you see will be steel encased with concrete, maybe for durability reasons. Other than that it's a pretty normal bridge as a lot of bridges will have a concrete deck. Just looks a bit 'heavy'.
I was looking up at the cantilever two-deck bridge at Meadowhall M1 tonight. the bridge is constructed of a sprung frame with a series of concrete blocks in between the girders. Always makes me feels uneasy going along the lower deck as the bridge moves with the weight of lorries etc, you can feel it spring.
RIP all those terrified souls and hopefully the survivors get the treatment needed.
The journey I took recently from Nice to Genoa featured what seemed like dozens of these high up viaduct bridges including this one. Didn't like going over them at all and would hate it even more now. People must be terrified to do so after this and a huge amount of these bridges will all need proper safety checks to avoid another terrible tragedy.
if seems as if this tragedy is already being used as a political tool against the EU.
Deputy Premier Matteo Salvini claims the deadly collapse of a bridge is the fault of EU budget constraints. that the deficit is jeopardising infrastructure repairs.
“We should ask ourselves whether respecting these [fiscal] limits is more important than the safety of Italian citizens. Obviously for me it is not,”
I hate politicians so much, they've not even found all the survivors or victims yet and this arsehole is already trying to make political capital out of it.
The journey I took recently from Nice to Genoa featured what seemed like dozens of these high up viaduct bridges including this one. Didn't like going over them at all and would hate it even more now. People must be terrified to do so after this and a huge amount of these bridges will all need proper safety checks to avoid another terrible tragedy.
Depends if the safety checks are fit for purpose? If they're not done properly or building regs are substandard then this type of thing will possibly happen again.
After the Grenfell fiasco in the UK it does make you wonder if regulations are adequate?
Blame the EU all you like, look at the party now in charge of Italy
I wasn't blaming the EU, I was quoting an Italian politician who had referred to the Fiscal Limits imposed by the EU.
He was no doubt implying that, because of the EU Fiscal Limits, it was the austerity measures thus imposed by the Italian government and subsequent cuts in budget, that has resulted in a reduction or lack of basic maintenance.
Blame the EU all you like, look at the party now in charge of Italy
I wasn't blaming the EU, I was quoting an Italian politician who had referred to the Fiscal Limits imposed by the EU.
He was no doubt implying that, because of the EU Fiscal Limits, it was the austerity measures thus imposed by the Italian government and subsequent cuts in budget, that has resulted in a reduction or lack of basic maintenance.
The Italian government have to take responsibility for this.
“We should ask ourselves whether respecting these [fiscal] limits is more important than the safety of Italian citizens. Obviously for me it is not,”
I am sorry, but yes the fiscal limits should be kept. One could make this exact same case for almost every single cause. Healthcare. Infrastructure. Homeless. Poverty Programs. Refugees. Education. Everyone can name multiple causes that one could say theoretically is "more important that fiscal responsibility."
I agree that this is an issue, and it is in almost every country, but no-limit spending to supposedly reduce suffering will just turn Italy and Spain and other such countries into Turkey, Venezuela and the like. Better to cut spending in other areas and re-direct it to infrastructure. Deficit spending is just kicking the can down to the next generation. People need to be willing to make difficult choices.
I think he is saying that essential infrastructure is not being repaired or properly maintained - because there is no money to do so.
He is also saying there is no money because of EU fiscal limits.
I know what he is saying. Fiscal limits are there for a reason. To me it is absurd that the world operates in a manner where every country runs a permanent deficit every year, building up debt levels that will eventually take down the global economy. And that trying to put even a CAP on deficits is somehow considered austerity. When a family continually spends more than it makes, it is considered irresponsible. When countries do it, it is considered somehow good.
Anyone wanna show me how the following is sustainable?
Comments
Some people will have witnessed an unimaginably gruesome scene. It will take much longer for some witnesses to rebuild their lives than for the bridge to be replaced.
if seems as if this tragedy is already being used as a political tool against the EU.
Deputy Premier Matteo Salvini claims the deadly collapse of a bridge is the fault of EU budget constraints. that the deficit is jeopardising infrastructure repairs.
“We should ask ourselves whether respecting these [fiscal] limits is more important than the safety of Italian citizens. Obviously for me it is not,”
I agree that this is an issue, and it is in almost every country, but no-limit spending to supposedly reduce suffering will just turn Italy and Spain and other such countries into Turkey, Venezuela and the like. Better to cut spending in other areas and re-direct it to infrastructure. Deficit spending is just kicking the can down to the next generation. People need to be willing to make difficult choices. Debt is not free.
He is also saying there is no money because of EU fiscal limits.
Anyone wanna show me how the following is sustainable?
http://www.usdebtclock.org/world-debt-clock.html
Some of the people at work were speaking with one of our clients in Genoa a couple of weeks ago. It would seem the biggest problem with infrastructure projects there is the corruption and criminality surrounding the construction industry. Whatever the government are paying for civil works, large chunks of it are getting 'diverted' and the jobs are being finished on the cheap and substandard.
Blame the EU all you like, look at the party now in charge of Italy
RIP
RIP all those terrified souls and hopefully the survivors get the treatment needed.
After the Grenfell fiasco in the UK it does make you wonder if regulations are adequate?
He was no doubt implying that, because of the EU Fiscal Limits, it was the austerity measures thus imposed by the Italian government and subsequent cuts in budget, that has resulted in a reduction or lack of basic maintenance.
Can't everyone agree to re-set the clock to zero - I mean it's never going to be paid back?
Should be treated like student debt