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Home rental - deposit return

Hi there,

I wonder if some on here with experience or insight into home rental deposits may be able to offer me some advice.

To set the scene:

My wife and I terminated a home rental after circa five years on 20th November 2017, as we had bought our first house together. Previously we both (separately) have a 100% track record of fully returned deposits and favourable references and we are not anti-landlords per se, as we know they deal with many bad tenants as visa versa, but just so you understand that we're average, decent people who always paid rent on time etc etc. We knew we'd probably have issues when it came to the deposit return due to the way the landlord had behaved over certain issues down the years, but that is by the by and irrelevant in respect of the following issue.

Our combined deposit was £1,035 (protected by the TDS) and since our departure the landlord, via the letting agency (who manage some aspects on his behalf and who held the deposit) and I have been arguing the toss via email over some of the deposit.

We were initially informed by the agent that the landlord was claiming £781.00 and this was supported by an invoice that he had paid to a supplier to remedy the works that he believed were caused by us and this was broken down into different costs etc. Fine.

Now I initially fully accepted some elements of the claim, plus there were some that I reluctantly accepted (due to low value and to ease the negotiations). The remainder I absolutely challenged and that set about many emails back and forth (via the agent) of the landlord saying why he believed we were responsible for these costs and me saying why I thought we were not. My last offer had been £517.50 (i.e. half the deposit and 2/3rd of his claim, but it was going nowhere with neither of us budging over 10 or so weeks.

About a fortnight ago I asked for the undisputed amount (£1,035 - £781 - £96 checkout fee = £158) back from the agent, as after all it is my money and it had been nearly 3 months. They paid me by bank transfer.

Re, the disputed amount as it dragged on I suggested that the landlord just lodge his claim with the TDS and we let them (as an independent) come to a decision after we had each supplied our supporting evidence.

Now this is where (for me) it gets interesting, because the landlord then came back again saying my offer of £517.50 was not good enough against a claim of £1,366 - i.e. he had added a previously unclaimed £585 to the claim! I pointed this out to the agent who agreed he could not do that and said they'd go back and tell him. Fine.

A few days pass and then last Friday I get the following in an email from the agent:

"The full deposit amount has now been passed over to the TDS, the Landlord is raising the case himself.

The full amount of deposit has been requested from the TDS, they have asked for the full deposit minus the check out fee that was already charged. Are you able to transfer the £158 to us so we can send over to the TDS. The reason they have requested this is because the Landlord is claiming now for the full deposit, but when the TDS award they will send the money back to you directly.

Hope this makes sense? Any issues please give me a call."


My question therefore is......can he/they do that? Can the landlord change his claim 3 months after the process started now he's going down the official (TDS claim) route? Can the agent request back the originally undisputed amount of £158 that they had paid me?

I would massively appreciate any advice.

Thanks.

Comments

  • I don't have much knowledge of the TDS scheme but have used it twice having being in rental accommodation during my divorce, but on the broader subject of "whose money it is etc etc" I would stand your ground & definitely not return the £158 that was agreed that you could have back. It is your money after all. I would then counter claim saying that you have been more than reasonable over the return of YOUR deposit & let the TDS to sort it out.
  • @The Organiser

    I had a TDS case back in November when my son moved out of a property.
    I raised the claim on his behalf, and yes - they do send the money back directly once the claim has been judged.

    I won because the Check Out inventory did NOT mention some of the things the landlord was claiming for, and I repeat the key para for my adjudication below.


    TDS considers that all parties are entitled to rely upon the check in and check out reports as being the
    primary documents recording the condition of a property at the start, and at the end, of a tenancy. A
    comparison of these reports would show if a property had been returned in the same condition, and
    standard of cleanliness, that it was in at the start of the tenancy, and thus enable me to ascertain whether
    the tenant fulfilled their contractual obligations in this respect. A landlord is not entitled to betterment and
    must allow for fair wear and tear, although the scope of this does not extend to cleaning.


    In summary, if you put a decent response together when the adjudicator asks for it, and you rely on the inspection reports - you will have an excellent chance.
  • Thanks both.

    The agent has since come back today, saying that the landlord is within his right to amend his claim and it does happen.

    But they did add that in their experience it's unlikely he would be successful with all of the £781 claim anyway and that the fact he has changed the claim will work against him and that the TDS would be aware monies were returned to me and are now being pulled back.

    This may well just be bluff to get me to hurry up and pay them the money back, as they are waiting on it, before transferring the full £1,035 to the TDS tomorrow.

    Any additional advice would be well received before I pay back the £158 tomorrow.

    Cheers.
  • Thanks both.

    The agent has since come back today, saying that the landlord is within his right to amend his claim and it does happen.

    But they did add that in their experience it's unlikely he would be successful with all of the £781 claim anyway and that the fact he has changed the claim will work against him and that the TDS would be aware monies were returned to me and are now being pulled back.

    This may well just be bluff to get me to hurry up and pay them the money back, as they are waiting on it, before transferring the full £1,035 to the TDS tomorrow.

    Any additional advice would be well received before I pay back the £158 tomorrow.

    Cheers.

    Good luck. Can't stand chancers like your ex landlord.
  • @The Organiser

    The TDS will look to see that you have attempted to resolve the issues beforehand, as mediation is the last resort. From what you have said, it seems you are OK on this point.
    The TDS like to see the undisputed part of the deposit funds returned by the landlord within 10 working days - so he/she is already on shaky ground.

    It seems you have to send the balance to the TDS so that they can pay it to the landlord in the event that you lose your claim. Seems fair enough.

    In your claim you will point out that the landlord revised his deposit retention figure (unreasonably) - AFTER you had "agreed" what you were "disagreeing" over. Now, as an act of good faith you have refunded cash to the TDS so that they can adjudicate.

    Good luck.
  • iainment said:

    Thanks both.

    The agent has since come back today, saying that the landlord is within his right to amend his claim and it does happen.

    But they did add that in their experience it's unlikely he would be successful with all of the £781 claim anyway and that the fact he has changed the claim will work against him and that the TDS would be aware monies were returned to me and are now being pulled back.

    This may well just be bluff to get me to hurry up and pay them the money back, as they are waiting on it, before transferring the full £1,035 to the TDS tomorrow.

    Any additional advice would be well received before I pay back the £158 tomorrow.

    Cheers.

    Good luck. Can't stand chancers like your ex landlord.
    Cheers.

    I wouldn’t normally be so fussed but for someone as laid back as what I am, he’s really pressed my buttons the last few years.
  • Landlords wankers the lot of them. Mind you my first one done so much wrong I simply failed to pay my last 8 months rent he never chased me. Last one wanted to leave us without hot water so I said I'd use the local gym for showers and take it out of rent, unlawful but done the trick. Now me and the mrs are living with my parents whilst we save.

    Good luck with the dispute but more importantly well done on the mortgage.
  • Personally, I'd want to be seeing this request from the TDS in writing, and be sending the money to the TDS directly, not via the letting agent.
  • edited February 2018
    aliwibble said:

    Personally, I'd want to be seeing this request from the TDS in writing, and be sending the money to the TDS directly, not via the letting agent.

    Agree with @aliwibble .

    Why not contact TDS yourself and say that you are prepared, if necessary to facilitate resolution of the dispute, to pay the £158 directly to them but would like something in writing.

    After all if the agent really has paid across the remainder of the deposit TDS will be able to trace your individual case.
  • Call me a cynic if you like but is a letting agent going to act in the interests of a 'one off departing tenant' or a landlord from whom there is a prospect of repeat business?
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  • Everything on this thread is great reason (if you needed it) to never rent unless absolutely necessary.
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