Football is a passionate game and bad language is inevitable IN THE HEAT OF THE MOMENT but sustained abuse in those terms is just symptomatic of the declining standards we are suffering in society as a whole.
As for the smoke bombs / flares I really don't know how anyone can defend them in a crowd situation. I hope the bloke is banned for life.
I'm probably the only one on here who will give a damn about this but on Sunday morning I met a Gillingham season ticket holder. After giving me the inevitable stick following our poor performance he said this:
'What the hell has happened to your Club? You seem to have a real scummy element now. it seemed like a Millwall match yesterday. I always thought Charlton had decent fans.'
I don't like my Club's reputation being tarnished by scum personally.
*Awaits he's only a fucking Jills what the fuck does his fucking opinion matter Jills ! Etc*
I think the atmosphere at the Valley yesterday might have been more appropriate yesterday for a kid, much more family orientated, rather than a few beered up lads trying to show how 'ard they are in front of their mates.
I don't think that is a justification but the problem is where to draw the line?
Some will say racism, homophobia, swearing, pyro are OK (fewer and fewer of the first two, thankfully) as "it's football, it always happends" others won't.
So who decides? Somethings are already illegal and rightly so IMHO, others are a gray area such as the swearing.
It's better taking your son to a game where only have 200 or 300 at an away game. Probably won't take much more than that to our next two. Beside which Gillingham was full of 12 year olds kids smoking and drinking in the street. One kid of about 12 or 13 was smoking something which didn't smell like a normal cigarette.
no doubt about it though, our support is definitely a lot more laddish in numbers / edgy for local games than it used to be 20 years ago. Whether that's football / society in general or how our support has moved on I don't know (and not saying its right or wrong), but the percentage beered up / yoof etc is a lot higher than when I was 20 imo.
On the points Swis makes, I don't like the word particularly (as shown by the amount of time I spend editing it out of posts on here), and would have been very uncomfortable with my kids with me on Saturday. But that's partly the point though, I think it was common knowledge what the make up of our support was going to be on Saturday and I would not have exposed my kids (7yo) to those potential scenarios and would have got tickets in the home end had I been desperate to take them (I'm no angel and suspect I was a swearing machine for the last 20 minutes).
Yes, a bit sad that I'm potentially saying 'you can't take young kids in the away end to local games', but I think you equally have to be a bit realistic about it and weigh up what the potential negatives are / could be. If I was to take young kids to an away game and wanted to avoid exposure to certain behaviour, I'd be very careful in selecting which ones I went to. Saturday would not have been one of them.
Took my lad on Saturday and we were directly in front of the lad and his mates that got nicked for the flare.
Found it quite ironic that he is from Faversham bearing in mind the abuse he was giving the Gills fans for their travelling community heritage..
On a more serious point my lad knew he was going to be stood on his seat all game and shouldn't repeat the language he heard so no issues there but we haven't half got some slags following us for these local away games now.
Im all for getting a few beers in before the game as that creates the atmosphere but don't get the need to throw flares in daylight (cringey and very Palace), break seats for a 'laugh' and just generally act a prick.
Football is a passionate game and bad language is inevitable IN THE HEAT OF THE MOMENT but sustained abuse in those terms is just symptomatic of the declining standards we are suffering in society as a whole.
As for the smoke bombs / flares I really don't know how anyone can defend them in a crowd situation. I hope the bloke is banned for life.
I'm probably the only one on here who will give a damn about this but on Sunday morning I met a Gillingham season ticket holder. After giving me the inevitable stick following our poor performance he said this:
'What the hell has happened to your Club? You seem to have a real scummy element now. it seemed like a Millwall match yesterday. I always thought Charlton had decent fans.'
I don't like my Club's reputation being tarnished by scum personally.
*Awaits he's only a fucking Jills what the fuck does his fucking opinion matter Jills ! Etc*
did you let him get on finishing your driveway after your chat
I got there late as I had other things to do on Saturday and the demographic outside the ground at 3pm was almost entirely males of a certain age - most of whom had probably just come out of the pub (nothing wrong with that). But that is not representative of our support in general or even our away support in general, which is more diverse.
It's more typical of local aways but I think the shit facilities at Gillingham, standing and previous post-match behaviour has filtered out a lot of the older fans, families etc.
Flares and swearing don't bother me as such but I don't think they are exciting either, which some appear to thInk they are. Some of the abuse of individual players is moronic but there's nothing new there. And it was a terrible game. I expect if we'd won some people would be hailIng it as a great day out.
As I said - I expect to hear a bit of language - but the specific words used, the frequency of it and the way it was being spat out was disgusting and unnecessary.
If you're comfortable with your kids saying things like that then that's up to you - but I am not.
Well the C word (i'll refer to it like this in order not to offend you ) is pretty common place. If you watch a lot of major US series, it's used a lot. Game of Thrones uses the word in almost every episode. I watched the new Mitchell and Webb comedy recently and it was used. It's one of those things where something is used a lot, people become de-sensitised to it.
I personally don't have a problem with the word in general and whilst it might be unpleasant for your kids to hear it, it's not a taboo word any more, it's a very common swear word just like fuck and shit IMO. I wouldn't expect to hear that kind of language in the family stand at The Valley (though I'm sure you do from time to time), but when your at an away game like Gillingham and sitting among the masses, you've got to expect it.
Its a derby, people get pissed up. Gonna be a few that spout crap. Sometimes if you don't like something you just gotta move. Yes you shouldn't have to blah blah blah but if I had my boy with me then I would have moved. Rather then stay there so I had a story to tell everyone on Charlton Life Monday morning.
There was nowhere to move to. That's part of the problem.
Mate. I know exactly where you were sat as I was probably just behind you. Couldn't see anything because of the crossbar blocking the view and couldn't stand up through fear of the fella behind having a coronary. You're right though, all the last comers just came in and congregated in that area. Highlight for me was a young fella (no more than 19), about 8 stone soaking wet through, getting himself in a right state coz people around him weren't singing! So sad to be so angry at such a young age! Makes you proud. Very funny though.
Anyway, went on a scouting mission at half time and found space over in the far corner. Even better still, met Konsa's aunt and uncle, plus his really excited young cousin.
What really disappoints me about this thread is the constant reference to this match as a "Derby"! It is not a derby, Charlton are from London, admittedly from the east side of London and Kent is probably the nearest county but Charlton is in Inner London, not Greater London like Welling or Bromley. If Kent is the Garden of England, then Gillingham is the compost heap!
I don't think it's a matter of just the word, but the persistence and aggression in its delivery usually by just one or two individuals and that horrible feeling of being able to do nothing about it without starting a fight. Didn't go on Saturday but sympathise as seen it often before.
Usually those involved are just one or two in number surrounded by their sheep like hangers on. They are serious demented in some way. I'd speculate further and say low self esteem and absence of positive role models in life. Again, wouldn't necessarily be comfortable suggesting that to their faces but happy not to go these days when so predictable that a few of these will be coming out the woodwork.
Comments
Football is a passionate game and bad language is inevitable IN THE HEAT OF THE MOMENT but sustained abuse in those terms is just symptomatic of the declining standards we are suffering in society as a whole.
As for the smoke bombs / flares I really don't know how anyone can defend them in a crowd situation. I hope the bloke is banned for life.
I'm probably the only one on here who will give a damn about this but on Sunday morning I met a Gillingham season ticket holder. After giving me the inevitable stick following our poor performance he said this:
'What the hell has happened to your Club? You seem to have a real scummy element now. it seemed like a Millwall match yesterday. I always thought Charlton had decent fans.'
I don't like my Club's reputation being tarnished by scum personally.
*Awaits he's only a fucking Jills what the fuck does his fucking opinion matter Jills ! Etc*
Then again he is 18
Some think anything is OK as "it's football".
I don't think that is a justification but the problem is where to draw the line?
Some will say racism, homophobia, swearing, pyro are OK (fewer and fewer of the first two, thankfully) as "it's football, it always happends" others won't.
So who decides? Somethings are already illegal and rightly so IMHO, others are a gray area such as the swearing.
On the points Swis makes, I don't like the word particularly (as shown by the amount of time I spend editing it out of posts on here), and would have been very uncomfortable with my kids with me on Saturday. But that's partly the point though, I think it was common knowledge what the make up of our support was going to be on Saturday and I would not have exposed my kids (7yo) to those potential scenarios and would have got tickets in the home end had I been desperate to take them (I'm no angel and suspect I was a swearing machine for the last 20 minutes).
Yes, a bit sad that I'm potentially saying 'you can't take young kids in the away end to local games', but I think you equally have to be a bit realistic about it and weigh up what the potential negatives are / could be. If I was to take young kids to an away game and wanted to avoid exposure to certain behaviour, I'd be very careful in selecting which ones I went to. Saturday would not have been one of them.
Found it quite ironic that he is from Faversham bearing in mind the abuse he was giving the Gills fans for their travelling community heritage..
On a more serious point my lad knew he was going to be stood on his seat all game and shouldn't repeat the language he heard so no issues there but we haven't half got some slags following us for these local away games now.
Im all for getting a few beers in before the game as that creates the atmosphere but don't get the need to throw flares in daylight (cringey and very Palace), break seats for a 'laugh' and just generally act a prick.
Maybe im getting old, or just not a moron?
Made a few laugh as it was well intentioned, factually correct and got the point across quickly.
JOKE !
Make you feel big does it?
It's more typical of local aways but I think the shit facilities at Gillingham, standing and previous post-match behaviour has filtered out a lot of the older fans, families etc.
Flares and swearing don't bother me as such but I don't think they are exciting either, which some appear to thInk they are. Some of the abuse of individual players is moronic but there's nothing new there. And it was a terrible game. I expect if we'd won some people would be hailIng it as a great day out.
I personally don't have a problem with the word in general and whilst it might be unpleasant for your kids to hear it, it's not a taboo word any more, it's a very common swear word just like fuck and shit IMO. I wouldn't expect to hear that kind of language in the family stand at The Valley (though I'm sure you do from time to time), but when your at an away game like Gillingham and sitting among the masses, you've got to expect it.
Anyway, went on a scouting mission at half time and found space over in the far corner. Even better still, met Konsa's aunt and uncle, plus his really excited young cousin.
If Kent is the Garden of England, then Gillingham is the compost heap!
Usually those involved are just one or two in number surrounded by their sheep like hangers on. They are serious demented in some way. I'd speculate further and say low self esteem and absence of positive role models in life. Again, wouldn't necessarily be comfortable suggesting that to their faces but happy not to go these days when so predictable that a few of these will be coming out the woodwork.