[cite]Posted By: Ross-CharltonThe 21s[/cite]After the signings if varney and iwelumo this surely means darren is going to leave in the summer do you think these two will be good signings ?
I'm hoping that it means that DB is staying and that Marcus Bent and Lisbie will be off.......
think we all knew that moment he rifled in at anfield was his farewell goal to be honest and good luck to him, deserves every success, just hope we can get the right deal for him
think varney & iwelumo will do their jobs the year (provided we get another body in up front) and varney may well kick on and produce the goods at a higher level
mate you seriously have to be on a wind-up don't you? we paid jfh FORTY GRAND A WEEK plus a massive signing on fee, we could sustain that in the championship could we? judging from last season would it be worth even trying to?
as for marcus bent... we've never had a worse role-model for our football club except perhaps the druggies in the early 90's - he is overpaid, lazy, uncaring and arrogant. did you go to anfield? did you pay X amount of money and sing yourself hoarse to watch him prance down the tunnel just as the ref put the whistle to his lips? if you did you must be bonkers
this season is about cutting the overpaid, unworkmanlike crap and replacing it with hungry players with something to prove that are paid the average going rate
ps. don't worry, re. marcus you will probably get your wish as no other club would be stupid enough to take him off our hands
^^^^ he is right jfh is fat overpayed lazy and old and marcus bent couldnt care in the slightest about charlton . the tunnel incident at anfield sumed it all up he just does not care
i tell you what i saw leaburn score a hat-trick at portman rd and thought it was the second coming, the only hat-trick i could see marcus scoring, the 3am girls would be more interested than match of the day
Hasselbaink and Marcus would be a good pair of Chamionship strikers. I stand by that regardless. Like I said though, I shall have custard with my humble pie if I'm wrong.
[cite]Posted By: cunningstunt87[/cite]Hasselbaink and Marcus would be a good pair of Chamionship strikers. I stand by that regardless. Like I said though, I shall have custard with my humble pie if I'm wrong.
They have the ability but not the desire to do it for 46 games.
The new boys (to use a famous Curbism) are hungry and that can only be to our benefit re getting promoted.
No one will be more pleased than me if Benty stayed until Christmas at least.
But no one would be more suprised than me if he did.
This isn't a situation of someone throwing a paddy and desperately wanting away. My view is that WE need to sell Darren to help offset the massive shortfall in wages we will have to bridge for next season. I'm pretty sure he is open to a move to a top-six club as well, and i don't blame him if the right offer comes.
Luke Young on the other hand would be a massive player for us in the CCC. If we get £2m more than anticipated for Benty I hope we pull the stops out to keep Young, useful all across the back four and means we can sell TEK and Herman.
If he does stay, it would make up for last pre season and would also mean him staying for the forseeable future and dare I say it becoming a bit of a Charlton legend (250 odd games already for us).
Would also be a massive statement if we can keep hold of an England fringe player.
[cite]Posted By: AFKA Bartram[/cite]No one will be more pleased than me if Benty stayed until Christmas at least.
But no one would be more suprised than me if he did.
This isn't a situation of someone throwing a paddy and desperately wanting away. My view is that WE need to sell Darren to help offset the massive shortfall in wages we will have to bridge for next season. I'm pretty sure he is open to a move to a top-six club as well, and i don't blame him if the right offer comes.
This is the popular view but I am not certain that it's founded on reality. There is no doubt that selling Darren will help the finances but, why sell an asset to cover current expenditure, that's like selling off the silver to pay for the servants wages?
If Charlton are sensible (we all believe they are) they would organise their affairs around two budgets, one if we stay up and the other if we go down. They will have employed many staff on fixed term contracts and some players will be on big pay cuts or release clauses if we go down.
Where there may be a problem for us is the mortgage on the ground secured against revenue stream and may be that is where it would be desirable to reduce our long term debt. Because our revenue has been slashed, we may well have to re-finance at a significant additional risk premium. Selling Darren will help us to manage this better by reducing borrowings and reliance on costly mortgage repayments.
To be desperate to sell Darren only encourages clubs to take the piss with undervalued offers so I suspect we dont have to sell him but will be open to offers if the price is right. It also depends on the player but I suspect that is not going to be a problem either way for Darren.
[cite]Posted By: cunningstunt87[/cite]Hasselbaink and Marcus would be a good pair of Chamionship strikers. I stand by that regardless. Like I said though, I shall have custard with my humble pie if I'm wrong.
First, I think JFH was on considerably less than £40K a week when he signed for us, more reliable estimates suggest £15-20k/week, still a horrendous amount of money for so few goals.
Second, on paper JFH offers more than Varney and/or Iwulemo, he has the experience, international caps and has been playing at a high level for over a decade, with his experience he should be looking at 20 goals in a CCC season. But he won't score that with us, why? Because he's no di Canio who at a similarish age relished playing the game and treated it as the privilege it was. JFH just has the wrong mindset, he's made his name and his money. The drop in wages to something that most would consider a king's ransom was to him a useful paycheck for a year, nothing more - what was it that one of the super models once said "I don't get out of bed for less than £10k", JFH is the footballing equivalent of whoever that airhead model. Give me players who want to play and who would run through brick walls. JFH was never known at any stage of his career for his workrate, he really had the talent to be a great, and other than a couple of seasons he was content to play sporadically, when he felt like it. At Charlton where players have to outperform and out think the opposition he was clearly in the wrong place, unfortunately for us it was also the wrong time as we desperately needed his goals and his experience and except in flashes we got neither.
So, my vote says start afresh, cut the deadwood out and rebuild. There are two ways out off the CCC - promotion or relegation. With a non-performing JFH we'd be looking at the latter. Goals will get us out the CCC and in Varney, Iwulemo and maybe Dickson we have three strikers, maybe augmented by Darren Bent if he stays, maybe another to come in if he goes. In the meantime we've given marcus Bent and JFH their chance and neither has taken it. Time to bring the next generation of players through.
Some good points, BFR but a bit harsh on JFH, for all his failings.
The main problem appears to me that he was just not sufficiently physically mobile to play within the type of game plan all 3 Charlton managers last season adopted.
Charlton invariably play the channels and this requires a quick first half-yard and good pace to outstrip defenders.
JFH, especially at his age was never going to be able to play within that system.
A lack of good crossing, despite playing with 2 wingers, meant very little of the type of service that JFH typically thrived on. In dead ball situations, corners especially, where his ability in the air could have counted, the delivery was generally inept.
Would JFH have been a success for us in the CCC?
Only if he was provided with good service for him to finish.
No point expecting him to run when he clearly could no longer.
Comments
I'm hoping that it means that DB is staying and that Marcus Bent and Lisbie will be off.......
think varney & iwelumo will do their jobs the year (provided we get another body in up front) and varney may well kick on and produce the goods at a higher level
as for marcus bent... we've never had a worse role-model for our football club except perhaps the druggies in the early 90's - he is overpaid, lazy, uncaring and arrogant. did you go to anfield? did you pay X amount of money and sing yourself hoarse to watch him prance down the tunnel just as the ref put the whistle to his lips? if you did you must be bonkers
this season is about cutting the overpaid, unworkmanlike crap and replacing it with hungry players with something to prove that are paid the average going rate
ps. don't worry, re. marcus you will probably get your wish as no other club would be stupid enough to take him off our hands
and marcus bent couldnt care in the slightest about charlton . the tunnel incident at anfield sumed it all up he just does not care
He sometimes comes out with some good ones so i shall keep an open mind.
And some people would rather them
Oh dear
They have the ability but not the desire to do it for 46 games.
The new boys (to use a famous Curbism) are hungry and that can only be to our benefit re getting promoted.
I remember that hat trick we ended up winning 5-1 didnt we
Would be brilliant if bent stayed another year 2 fire us 2 back were we belong
But no one would be more suprised than me if he did.
This isn't a situation of someone throwing a paddy and desperately wanting away. My view is that WE need to sell Darren to help offset the massive shortfall in wages we will have to bridge for next season. I'm pretty sure he is open to a move to a top-six club as well, and i don't blame him if the right offer comes.
Luke Young on the other hand would be a massive player for us in the CCC. If we get £2m more than anticipated for Benty I hope we pull the stops out to keep Young, useful all across the back four and means we can sell TEK and Herman.
If he does stay, it would make up for last pre season and would also mean him staying for the forseeable future and dare I say it becoming a bit of a Charlton legend (250 odd games already for us).
Would also be a massive statement if we can keep hold of an England fringe player.
This is the popular view but I am not certain that it's founded on reality. There is no doubt that selling Darren will help the finances but, why sell an asset to cover current expenditure, that's like selling off the silver to pay for the servants wages?
If Charlton are sensible (we all believe they are) they would organise their affairs around two budgets, one if we stay up and the other if we go down. They will have employed many staff on fixed term contracts and some players will be on big pay cuts or release clauses if we go down.
Where there may be a problem for us is the mortgage on the ground secured against revenue stream and may be that is where it would be desirable to reduce our long term debt. Because our revenue has been slashed, we may well have to re-finance at a significant additional risk premium. Selling Darren will help us to manage this better by reducing borrowings and reliance on costly mortgage repayments.
To be desperate to sell Darren only encourages clubs to take the piss with undervalued offers so I suspect we dont have to sell him but will be open to offers if the price is right. It also depends on the player but I suspect that is not going to be a problem either way for Darren.
As for the silver and servants, sadly you need the servants not silver to run the house...
First, I think JFH was on considerably less than £40K a week when he signed for us, more reliable estimates suggest £15-20k/week, still a horrendous amount of money for so few goals.
Second, on paper JFH offers more than Varney and/or Iwulemo, he has the experience, international caps and has been playing at a high level for over a decade, with his experience he should be looking at 20 goals in a CCC season. But he won't score that with us, why? Because he's no di Canio who at a similarish age relished playing the game and treated it as the privilege it was. JFH just has the wrong mindset, he's made his name and his money. The drop in wages to something that most would consider a king's ransom was to him a useful paycheck for a year, nothing more - what was it that one of the super models once said "I don't get out of bed for less than £10k", JFH is the footballing equivalent of whoever that airhead model. Give me players who want to play and who would run through brick walls. JFH was never known at any stage of his career for his workrate, he really had the talent to be a great, and other than a couple of seasons he was content to play sporadically, when he felt like it. At Charlton where players have to outperform and out think the opposition he was clearly in the wrong place, unfortunately for us it was also the wrong time as we desperately needed his goals and his experience and except in flashes we got neither.
So, my vote says start afresh, cut the deadwood out and rebuild. There are two ways out off the CCC - promotion or relegation. With a non-performing JFH we'd be looking at the latter. Goals will get us out the CCC and in Varney, Iwulemo and maybe Dickson we have three strikers, maybe augmented by Darren Bent if he stays, maybe another to come in if he goes. In the meantime we've given marcus Bent and JFH their chance and neither has taken it. Time to bring the next generation of players through.
The main problem appears to me that he was just not sufficiently physically mobile to play within the type of game plan all 3 Charlton managers last season adopted.
Charlton invariably play the channels and this requires a quick first half-yard and good pace to outstrip defenders.
JFH, especially at his age was never going to be able to play within that system.
A lack of good crossing, despite playing with 2 wingers, meant very little of the type of service that JFH typically thrived on. In dead ball situations, corners especially, where his ability in the air could have counted, the delivery was generally inept.
Would JFH have been a success for us in the CCC?
Only if he was provided with good service for him to finish.
No point expecting him to run when he clearly could no longer.