England Cricket Tours Of Bangladesh & India

Addick Addict

The Squads have just been announced:

Test (17):

Alastair Cook (Essex) Captain
Joe Root (Yorkshire) Vice Captain
Haseeb Hameed (Lancashire)
Gary Ballance (Yorkshire)
Ben Duckett (Northamptonshire)
Jonny Bairstow (Yorkshire)
Jos Buttler (Lancashire)
Ben Stokes (Durham)
Chris Woakes (Warwicks)
Moeen Ali (Worcestershire)
Adil Rashid (Yorkshire)
Gareth Batty (Surrey)
Zafar Ansari (Surrey)
Mark Wood (Durham)
Stuart Broad (Nottinghamshire)
James Anderson (Lancashire)
Steven Finn (Middlesex)

ODI (15):

Jos Buttler (Lancashire) Captain
Jason Roy (Surrey)
Ben Duckett (Northamptonshire)
Jonny Bairstow (Yorkshire)
James Vince (Hampshire)
Ben Stokes (Durham)
Chris Woakes (Warwicks)
Sam Billings (Kent)
Moeen Ali (Worcestershire)
Adil Rashid (Yorkshire)
Mark Wood (Durham)
Liam Plunkett (Yorkshire)
David Willey (Yorkshire)
Jake Ball (Nottinghamshire)
Liam Dawson (Hampshire)

sam3110

Don't watch county stuff, are Duckett, Hameed and Ansari any good?

Addick Addict

sam3110 said:

Don't watch county stuff, are Duckett, Hameed and Ansari any good?

Hameed is only 19 but averages over 50 in the CC Division 1 this season and is made for Test cricket - he has never even played a one day game let alone a T20 for Lancashire.

Duckett averages over 45 in the CC for Northants and has scored over 3000 runs in all forms of the game this season.

Ansari is a batting spinner who has come back from injury this season. The presence of his captain, 38 year old Gareth Batty, will no doubt help his progress.

Pedro45

Vince dropped from the test squad (with Hales not travelling), and Root missing from ODI's (with Hales and Morgan not going) means both sides will have a different look.

killerandflash

http://www.skysports.com/cricket/news/12123/10579925/england-call-up-ben-duckett-haseeb-hameed-and-zafar-ansari-for-bangladesh-tour

So 4 spinners in the Test squad. Hameed as opener, not sure who else would play there, if one was injured Ansari or Duckett?

Finn and Wood in the Test squad, I can't imagine they'll get much game time though

Addickted2TheReds

Northeast - 1103 runs @ 73.53
Duckett - 1338 runs @ 60.82

I'm not saying Duckett shouldn't be on the plane, because he clearly should, but Northeast should be too.

Addick Addict

Addickted2TheReds said:

Northeast - 1103 runs @ 73.53
Duckett - 1338 runs @ 60.82

I'm not saying Duckett shouldn't be on the plane, because he clearly should, but Northeast should be too.

I'm afraid it's the old Div 1 v Div 2 argument. And it's also where the selectors go to watch their cricket. Apart from those centrally contracted (Cook and Ali), Duckett and Billings are the only players regularly playing in Div 2 to gain a spot in either squad. It won't be long before they are probably playing top flight cricket either.

Addickted2TheReds

Addick Addict said:

Addickted2TheReds said:

Northeast - 1103 runs @ 73.53
Duckett - 1338 runs @ 60.82

I'm not saying Duckett shouldn't be on the plane, because he clearly should, but Northeast should be too.

I'm afraid it's the old Div 1 v Div 2 argument. And it's also where the selectors go to watch their cricket. Apart from those centrally contracted (Cook and Ali), Duckett and Billings are the only players regularly playing in Div 2 to gain a spot in either squad. It won't be long before they are probably playing top flight cricket either.

Oh, yes, absolutely.

I know what it comes down to, but it's still bollocks.

Ballance over Northeast? Ha.

soapboxsam

The BBC website said Ben Duckett was 22 and right handed.
He bats Left handed and is 21. He have been known to bowl right handed.
I would give my right arm to be ambidextrous.

killerandflash

soapboxsam said:

The BBC website said Ben Duckett was 22 and right handed.
He bats Left handed and is 21. He have been known to bowl right handed.
I would give my right arm to be ambidextrous.

A lot of players bat the "wrong way round" but then batting is a 2 handed activity anyway

McBobbin

Gareth Batty? Why is he in the test squad? To support Ansari?

cantersaddick

The telegraph leaked this squad last night so I've been mulling over it for a while... I think Hameed had to go but I'm worried it may be too early for him and we could set him back a bit. I would have taken Borthwick as a top order batsman and possible 3rd spinner...

Rumors are that Moeen will replace Vince in the middle order..

Expecting something like:
Cook
Hameed
Root
Bairstow
Moeen
Stokes
Ansari
Woakes
Rashid
Broad
Anderson

Bit bowler heavy, perhaps Ballance will be in for Ansari? Basically I have no idea.

Disappointed that Foakes didn't go as back up keeper. He is by a long way the best keeper in the country (with the exception of Foster) maybe they think his batting isn't up to it.. but he has played a lot more first class cricket than Buttler.

The other obvious talking points are Ansari who hasn't had the best season because if injuries but it's obvious the talent is there and I am glad the selectors have stick with him after he didn't make the tour last winter.

And Batty, I think he is going as much as a coach/mentor for the younger spinners as he is as a player. I am one of his biggest fans and love his leadership, commitment and passion (something very Charlton about that, he is Surrey's version of JJ). But these attributes will only get you so far. He is though a very good bowler, constantly learning and developing. He has added one that goes the other way in the last couple of years and is bowling the best of his career. I always say spin bowlers peak later and we shouldn't expect 23-25yr olds to do it consistently for England. Batty may be an extreme example of this but we could do much worse as a stop gap. Think he is a good addition but don't expect him to play.

Agree with resting Root for the one dayers. We have such depth in that format it will be good to see Duckett/Bairstow/Billings/Vince get a run of games.

cantersaddick

McBobbin said:

Gareth Batty? Why is he in the test squad? To support Ansari?

Consistently one of the best spinners in the English game over the last few years. Maybe nothing spectacular but solid, reliable, knows his game inside out, experienced, been there and done it in every possible situation. Brilliant leader, committed, passionate and will help coach/mentor the younger spinners. Will only play as a stop gap due to his age, but we could do a lot worse. As I've said a million times before spin bowlers take much longer to learn their trade, most don't fully know their game until late 20s or early 30s. Yet we want 25yr old spinners to be consistent international players. Being a spinner is much different from being a fast bowler, it's all about that match experience. Having been there and done it all, having the confidence in your ability to back yourself to continue to toss it up even when the batsman is going for it. To get hit for six and trust your skills to get the next one right.

That only comes with experience. Okay batty is an extreme example at nearly 39 but so what. A good bowler who won't let us down of called upon. And if I'm right in thinking England don't have a full time spin coach. They pick people up on an ad hoc tour by tour basis. Well batty can help with that and coach the younger players.

FishCostaFortune

Moeen wont be batting above Stokes.

cantersaddick

FishCostaFortune said:

Moeen wont be batting above Stokes.

Those are the rumours coming out. They want to keep stokes at 6 long term so Moeen replaces Vince with Bairstow shuffling up the order.

killerandflash

It was said that Saqlain Mushtaq would find it difficult to get an Indian Visa, or something like that, so an elder statesman spinner like Batty makes sense.

It's tricky to know which bowlers to pick in India, as while pitches will be spin friendly, presumably the Indian batsmen will be used to playing spinners. It's hard to imagine Ansari terrorising them, even if he has a lot of promise as an all rounder

McBobbin

cantersaddick said:

McBobbin said:

Gareth Batty? Why is he in the test squad? To support Ansari?

Consistently one of the best spinners in the English game over the last few years. Maybe nothing spectacular but solid, reliable, knows his game inside out, experienced, been there and done it in every possible situation. Brilliant leader, committed, passionate and will help coach/mentor the younger spinners. Will only play as a stop gap due to his age, but we could do a lot worse. As I've said a million times before spin bowlers take much longer to learn their trade, most don't fully know their game until late 20s or early 30s. Yet we want 25yr old spinners to be consistent international players. Being a spinner is much different from being a fast bowler, it's all about that match experience. Having been there and done it all, having the confidence in your ability to back yourself to continue to toss it up even when the batsman is going for it. To get hit for six and trust your skills to get the next one right.

That only comes with experience. Okay batty is an extreme example at nearly 39 but so what. A good bowler who won't let us down of called upon. And if I'm right in thinking England don't have a full time spin coach. They pick people up on an ad hoc tour by tour basis. Well batty can help with that and coach the younger players.

I suppose they did the same with Shaun Udal in India

cantersaddick

McBobbin said:

cantersaddick said:

McBobbin said:

Gareth Batty? Why is he in the test squad? To support Ansari?

Consistently one of the best spinners in the English game over the last few years. Maybe nothing spectacular but solid, reliable, knows his game inside out, experienced, been there and done it in every possible situation. Brilliant leader, committed, passionate and will help coach/mentor the younger spinners. Will only play as a stop gap due to his age, but we could do a lot worse. As I've said a million times before spin bowlers take much longer to learn their trade, most don't fully know their game until late 20s or early 30s. Yet we want 25yr old spinners to be consistent international players. Being a spinner is much different from being a fast bowler, it's all about that match experience. Having been there and done it all, having the confidence in your ability to back yourself to continue to toss it up even when the batsman is going for it. To get hit for six and trust your skills to get the next one right.

That only comes with experience. Okay batty is an extreme example at nearly 39 but so what. A good bowler who won't let us down of called upon. And if I'm right in thinking England don't have a full time spin coach. They pick people up on an ad hoc tour by tour basis. Well batty can help with that and coach the younger players.

I suppose they did the same with Shaun Udal in India

Yep and that turned out to be a master stroke! Although I may be a bit biased on this one. I have a lot of man love for our Batts.

FishCostaFortune

cantersaddick said:

FishCostaFortune said:

Moeen wont be batting above Stokes.

Those are the rumours coming out. They want to keep stokes at 6 long term so Moeen replaces Vince with Bairstow shuffling up the order.

Ah okay, I hope Moeen goes well there then - I do like him as a cricketer.

McBobbin

cantersaddick said:

McBobbin said:

cantersaddick said:

McBobbin said:

Gareth Batty? Why is he in the test squad? To support Ansari?

Consistently one of the best spinners in the English game over the last few years. Maybe nothing spectacular but solid, reliable, knows his game inside out, experienced, been there and done it in every possible situation. Brilliant leader, committed, passionate and will help coach/mentor the younger spinners. Will only play as a stop gap due to his age, but we could do a lot worse. As I've said a million times before spin bowlers take much longer to learn their trade, most don't fully know their game until late 20s or early 30s. Yet we want 25yr old spinners to be consistent international players. Being a spinner is much different from being a fast bowler, it's all about that match experience. Having been there and done it all, having the confidence in your ability to back yourself to continue to toss it up even when the batsman is going for it. To get hit for six and trust your skills to get the next one right.

That only comes with experience. Okay batty is an extreme example at nearly 39 but so what. A good bowler who won't let us down of called upon. And if I'm right in thinking England don't have a full time spin coach. They pick people up on an ad hoc tour by tour basis. Well batty can help with that and coach the younger players.

I suppose they did the same with Shaun Udal in India

Yep and that turned out to be a master stroke! Although I may be a bit biased on this one. I have a lot of man love for our Batts.

I've seen him a couple of times this season in T20 matches, and he can keep it tight. Obviously a wiley performer.

Lincsaddick

few bold and forward looking selections:

Hameed .. proper opener .. hope that he can keep his nerves in order
Duckett .. master blaster against pace .. how will he cope with spin ?
Batty .. still room for an old master ..

pity there is no room for Hameed's teammate Liam Livingstone .. potentially one of the very best batsman in England

odd that Vince is no go for the test but is included for the one dayers

should be a good and interesting tour

Leuth

I have an inkling how Duckett will cope with spin. There will be reverse-sweeping

cantersaddick

If batty does an interview I have a fun drinking game.

Drink once when he says 'he's a fine player' or 'real team performance'.

Drink twice when he says 'wonderful' or 'magnificent'.

Will be absolutely smashed after a 5 minute interview.

If you don't belive me watch some of his interviews for Surrey.

redman

Canters - really can't the point of playing 7 bowlers in the side.

Alwaysneil

Leuth said:

I have an inkling how Duckett will cope with spin. There will be reverse-sweeping

He's not going to get under the ball that way. I would have thought he'd be better getting out of the way of the bouncer.

Everybody shout....

cantersaddick

redman said:

Canters - really can't the point of playing 7 bowlers in the side.

Agreed that's why I said Ballance in for Ansari and shift everyone down a spot but that's what the rumours seem to be...

Ben18

Surprised Keaton Jennings hasn't had much of a mention.

Opens for Durham, top run scorer in Div 1 this season, and recently qualified to play for England (grew up in South Africa, but his mum is English)

Bangkokaddick

I was a bit surprised at Ansari being picked as his season hasn't been exactly spectacular, but he can of course fill in as an opener if either of the others gets an injury. Pleased for him, though, as he must have been gutted at that thumb injury last tear that prevented him from going.

4 players of Asian descent in the squad but why aren't there any Afro-Caribbeans these days? A few years ago you could have picked a good English XI made up of purely black players. Are they all playing football and basketball?

Addick Addict

Bangkokaddick said:

I was a bit surprised at Ansari being picked as his season hasn't been exactly spectacular, but he can of course fill in as an opener if either of the others gets an injury. Pleased for him, though, as he must have been gutted at that thumb injury last tear that prevented him from going.

4 players of Asian descent in the squad but why aren't there any Afro-Caribbeans these days? A few years ago you could have picked a good English XI made up of purely black players. Are they all playing football and basketball?

The biggest influx of cricketers at Club level is from the Asian community. Cricket is their sport and their families treat it only behind family life itself and the success of those children academically. They simply do not have the distraction of other sports whereas kids of Afro-Caribbean descent are built for the likes of football, rugby, athletics so very often have to make a choice. And football nowadays is almost an all year round sport.

To give you an example of what I am suggesting, my son this season played cricket against St Olaves, a "super selective" school. Of the 11 in the other team, eight were Asian, one was Afro-Caribbean and two were white (one of those plays for Surrey). Obviously this varies from age group to age group and area to area but at County U13 level this season more than half of the Essex and Middlesex sides were made up of boys of Asian extraction.

McBobbin

Is there not an Asian club league that plays in parallel to the established club system? I'm sure Essex had a player briefly called.tanvir sikhander who came from this league, and was amongst the first to do so. Apologies for my half baked knowledge on this, but apparently it's difficult to get kids from the Asian league to play in the other club system

Gravesend_Addick

I don't know why the ECB are so surprised by this discovery!

http://m.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/37384828