on the OS, Ambrose is quoted as saying that he hopes Benty will stay. Given that they are good pals, he would know if DB was definitely leaving - so maybe he will still be here?
[cite]Posted By: Salad Spinner[/cite]on the OS, Ambrose is quoted as saying that he hopes Benty will stay.
Given that they are good pals, he would know if DB was definitely leaving - so maybe he will still be here?
Just thinking of ways to encourage DB to stay, not that I have a say in such matters, what if the club said - stay with us and get us promoted, and if that happens you can leave on a free transfer. If it doesn't happen at the end of the first season in the Championship, then we sell at market rates.
The value of the promotion would far outweigh the £8m fee that the BBC are quoting, we would not have to give 25% to Ipswich and Darren could set himself up for life.
I can't believe the 8-10 million price tag that the press are putting on Dazza, that seems very low.
The position seems to be that we really don't HAVE to sell him so people can't put a gun to our head.
Bent has got 30 league goals in 67 games in a very, very poor side which has only scored 73 goals in the 75 league games that have been played whilst he has been at the club.
Imagine how many goals he would score with someone like Ashton playing up front with him? Or with Kuyt or Bellamy? Or with Fabregas playing balls to his feet in the channels rather than have Elk pump things above his head?
Agreed Ormiston - look at Spurs getting £18m for Carrick - if people want Bent, we have to make them pay as much as possible.
Johnson was £8.5m - Bent is younger, he's proved himself in the Prem over 2 seasons, over 20 goals outfield last year whereas Johnson got 11 - we have to be lookign for at least £12m.
I think Darren will leave, unfortunately - Johnson missed out on the World Cup becuase he was in the Championship, Bent won't want to miss out on Euro 2010. I think we'd maybe bne able to keep him in an 'odd' season for 1 year to see if we went straight back up, but not with Euro 2010 at the end - so we need to get the best price.
Agree with Lookout. 15m at least. Although we don't know how true it was, a figure of 18m was bandied about in January. Although i accept we may have to take less than 18m as we're now relegated, we should be accepting nowhere near 8m. And remember of course we have to give some money to Ipswich as well so i can't see us under-selling with this one.
I can’t see any real possibility of Bent staying. The club need to sell. Bent wants to stay in the Premiership/England contention. I assume there will also be willing buyers.
Difficult to say what a ‘good’ price is. I think we have to regard the Ashley Young price as a rogue value, way over any sensible valuation. Andy Johnson is a better indicator. I think most managers regard Bent as the better goalscorer so £10 million is probably the minimum fire sale price but the price we probably should be looking for is £12 upwards. Every major club has watched Bent since he was a youth team player, but Curbs was sharp enough to get in quickly as soon as he was available as bigger clubs hesitated. Several managers thought Bent had too many rough edges to his game particularly his movement off the ball and decision making. I remember Curbs pointing to his goal scoring record – at every level he has played his ratio of goals to games is very good – only Michael Owen has a better scoring rate. The ‘hidden’ attribute that Bent has compared with many strikers is that he scores almost irrespective of his own form in that game or how well the team are doing – scoring in a poor team. That’s a very valuable commodity – e.g. think of the number points Arsenal have thrown away through poor finishing and what Bent could do in front of a creative midfield.
We should probably expect an early sale as this helps the club. The only danger of this is that the market level will not have been set for this summer and almost inevitably prices will rise throughout the summer.
If DB goes, and to be honest we know that's likely, we need an early sale ... actually scrubs that ... we just need an early commitment to sell, then we can budget for £8M and start planning and spending accordingly. Once Dazza is sold, hopefully for nearer £15M then some of the extra cash can be added to the pot.
I agree, if we are going to sell then lets do it early, we might not get the best price but at least we will know where we are and can pursue other targets.
I also think we should be willing to pay a little bit over the odds for our top targets to get them on board as early as we can.
It seems to me that bringing in players late in the day (Murphy, Jeffers, Diawara, Faye, Traore) has tended to lend itself to a disaster because they miss the whole pre-season and get chucked into the side with little fitness and no bonding with team mates. So, if we can bring in our key targets by July when pre-season starts then it must give us a better chance of coming back first time.
Wouldnt Owen go to Liverpool if the asking price was only 9m?
Murphy wasn't a disaster in my opinion.
The others weren't particularly last minute either, except maybe Jeffers, and as has been repeatedly said we didn't end up paying his whole fee.
Having said all that a club like ours may just have to take some last minute stuff, and as we now have transfer windows now there tends to be a lot of last minute dealing.
As for Bent I would imagine there was a clause in his last contract allowing him to go to a big 4 club providing we got at least our valuation of I would imagine £15m. The rest is just talk until the bidding gets over that marker.
[cite]Posted By: Ormiston Addick[/cite]I agree, if we are going to sell then lets do it early, we might not get the best price but at least we will know where we are and can pursue other targets.
I also think we should be willing to pay a little bit over the odds for our top targets to get them on board as early as we can.
It seems to me that bringing in players late in the day (Murphy, Jeffers, Diawara, Faye, Traore) has tended to lend itself to a disaster because they miss the whole pre-season and get chucked into the side with little fitness and no bonding with team mates. So, if we can bring in our key targets by July when pre-season starts then it must give us a better chance of coming back first time.
Pards and Parky have admitted that they have been identifying potential CCC targets for a few weeks now so hopefully the process will be sorted out sooner rather than later this year.
[cite]Posted By: Bruxelles_Addick[/cite]I can’t see any real possibility of Bent staying. The club need to sell. Bent wants to stay in the Premiership/England contention. I assume there will also be willing buyers.
Difficult to say what a ‘good’ price is. I think we have to regard the Ashley Young price as a rogue value, way over any sensible valuation. Andy Johnson is a better indicator. I think most managers regard Bent as the better goalscorer so £10 million is probably the minimum fire sale price but the price we probably should be looking for is £12 upwards. Every major club has watched Bent since he was a youth team player, but Curbs was sharp enough to get in quickly as soon as he was available as bigger clubs hesitated. Several managers thought Bent had too many rough edges to his game particularly his movement off the ball and decision making. I remember Curbs pointing to his goal scoring record – at every level he has played his ratio of goals to games is very good – only Michael Owen has a better scoring rate. The ‘hidden’ attribute that Bent has compared with many strikers is that he scores almost irrespective of his own form in that game or how well the team are doing – scoring in a poor team. That’s a very valuable commodity – e.g. think of the number points Arsenal have thrown away through poor finishing and what Bent could do in front of a creative midfield.
We should probably expect an early sale as this helps the club. The only danger of this is that the market level will not have been set for this summer and almost inevitably prices will rise throughout the summer.
Good points, for the last reason alone, i don't think it will be an early sale, i also think that some of the interested clubs will be interested in respect of their players moving on / failing to get other targets.
I think the buying season is going to kick in a lot later this Summer.
[cite]Posted By: razil[/cite]Wouldnt Owen go to Liverpool if the asking price was only 9m?
Murphy wasn't a disaster in my opinion.
The others weren't particularly last minute either, except maybe Jeffers, and as has been repeatedly said we didn't end up paying his whole fee.
Having said all that a club like ours may just have to take some last minute stuff, and as we now have transfer windows now there tends to be a lot of last minute dealing.
As for Bent I would imagine there was a clause in his last contract allowing him to go to a big 4 club providing we got at least our valuation of I would imagine £15m. The rest is just talk until the bidding gets over that marker.
Well, yeah, Owen would go to Liverpool but they don't want or need him and Rafa is not a fan.
Have to disagree about Murphy, I was not referring to his performances which were probably 33% good, 33% OK and 33% poor, but at the outcome of his time with us which was losing him after 60 games and not getting anything like 2.5 million of service out of him. He was a class player but we never saw enough of it for long enough.
Also, if you remember, although Romm arrived early, Jeffers and Murphy WERE both signed very late on as were Faye, Diawara and Traore which meant they were rushed into the team without a pre-season with the squad. Signing players late on can cause problems, although it is hard to avoid. In contrast, we signed Dazza in June 2005!!!
I know what you''re saying, Jeffers and Murphy were last minute, not sure about the rest but they were late in the sense of not being early if you know what I mean. So if its just pre season gelling you are talking about then cool.
My personal view on Murphy was it was bad management and therefore not a bad purchase.
Yeah, agreed about Murphy, it was bad management by Curbs which meant that our acquisition of a very talented player did, sadly, end in disaster because he left for 1 million less than we paid for him and we never even got the chance to sign a replacement because he left as the window closed.
if he goes i will be p*****d off. when was the last time anyone you knew left their job when their employer had a bad year, even when they were guaranteed to stay in their job without loss of earnings. on the point of Dazza's value. now that the big money is about to role in, if the nearly clubs want him they should be made to pay top dollar. he is the real deal and will get goals anywhere. he has got to be on the wish list of any manager seeking a striker this pre-season. come on charlton stand up for yourselves for once and hold out for £18 plus. you know one of them will pay it as august gets closer and the smell of sky money starts wafting in through the turnstiles. one season with benty in the championship would be great though. hope of hopes that he stays.
Razil: Yeah, I think you're right now I consider it. I think that the manner of his departure and his comments tended to cloud our view of what he brought to the squad which we have never looked like replacing.
Comments
Glad Ambrose is up for it and wants to fight to get us back and not wanting to do a Dennis
Perhaps Ambrose and I could twos up on him? ;-)
The value of the promotion would far outweigh the £8m fee that the BBC are quoting, we would not have to give 25% to Ipswich and Darren could set himself up for life.
Or am I being simplistic?
The position seems to be that we really don't HAVE to sell him so people can't put a gun to our head.
Bent has got 30 league goals in 67 games in a very, very poor side which has only scored 73 goals in the 75 league games that have been played whilst he has been at the club.
Imagine how many goals he would score with someone like Ashton playing up front with him? Or with Kuyt or Bellamy? Or with Fabregas playing balls to his feet in the channels rather than have Elk pump things above his head?
Johnson was £8.5m - Bent is younger, he's proved himself in the Prem over 2 seasons, over 20 goals outfield last year whereas Johnson got 11 - we have to be lookign for at least £12m.
I think Darren will leave, unfortunately - Johnson missed out on the World Cup becuase he was in the Championship, Bent won't want to miss out on Euro 2010. I think we'd maybe bne able to keep him in an 'odd' season for 1 year to see if we went straight back up, but not with Euro 2010 at the end - so we need to get the best price.
The Prem clubs are getting a massive cash injection with the new TV deal and will hopefully be fighting over Bent.
I mean, if Ashley Young (3 premiership goals for Watford) goes to Villa for 9.5 million then how on earth can Bent only be worth 8 million?
Of course, if Owen goes from Newcastle to Man Utd for 9 million (and he will, IMHO) then the Geordies will be in the market for a replacement....
Shame he hasn't been for the last two years.
then again we always undersell...
And remember of course we have to give some money to Ipswich as well so i can't see us under-selling with this one.
Difficult to say what a ‘good’ price is. I think we have to regard the Ashley Young price as a rogue value, way over any sensible valuation. Andy Johnson is a better indicator. I think most managers regard Bent as the better goalscorer so £10 million is probably the minimum fire sale price but the price we probably should be looking for is £12 upwards. Every major club has watched Bent since he was a youth team player, but Curbs was sharp enough to get in quickly as soon as he was available as bigger clubs hesitated. Several managers thought Bent had too many rough edges to his game particularly his movement off the ball and decision making. I remember Curbs pointing to his goal scoring record – at every level he has played his ratio of goals to games is very good – only Michael Owen has a better scoring rate. The ‘hidden’ attribute that Bent has compared with many strikers is that he scores almost irrespective of his own form in that game or how well the team are doing – scoring in a poor team. That’s a very valuable commodity – e.g. think of the number points Arsenal have thrown away through poor finishing and what Bent could do in front of a creative midfield.
We should probably expect an early sale as this helps the club. The only danger of this is that the market level will not have been set for this summer and almost inevitably prices will rise throughout the summer.
I also think we should be willing to pay a little bit over the odds for our top targets to get them on board as early as we can.
It seems to me that bringing in players late in the day (Murphy, Jeffers, Diawara, Faye, Traore) has tended to lend itself to a disaster because they miss the whole pre-season and get chucked into the side with little fitness and no bonding with team mates. So, if we can bring in our key targets by July when pre-season starts then it must give us a better chance of coming back first time.
Murphy wasn't a disaster in my opinion.
The others weren't particularly last minute either, except maybe Jeffers, and as has been repeatedly said we didn't end up paying his whole fee.
Having said all that a club like ours may just have to take some last minute stuff, and as we now have transfer windows now there tends to be a lot of last minute dealing.
As for Bent I would imagine there was a clause in his last contract allowing him to go to a big 4 club providing we got at least our valuation of I would imagine £15m. The rest is just talk until the bidding gets over that marker.
Good points, for the last reason alone, i don't think it will be an early sale, i also think that some of the interested clubs will be interested in respect of their players moving on / failing to get other targets.
I think the buying season is going to kick in a lot later this Summer.
Well, yeah, Owen would go to Liverpool but they don't want or need him and Rafa is not a fan.
Have to disagree about Murphy, I was not referring to his performances which were probably 33% good, 33% OK and 33% poor, but at the outcome of his time with us which was losing him after 60 games and not getting anything like 2.5 million of service out of him. He was a class player but we never saw enough of it for long enough.
Also, if you remember, although Romm arrived early, Jeffers and Murphy WERE both signed very late on as were Faye, Diawara and Traore which meant they were rushed into the team without a pre-season with the squad. Signing players late on can cause problems, although it is hard to avoid. In contrast, we signed Dazza in June 2005!!!
My personal view on Murphy was it was bad management and therefore not a bad purchase.
:)