I think we are now officially in a desperate position. What that means to me is that you try to take extreme steps to get yourselves out of that position. That may mean selling Lookman on the relative cheap to fund an escape attempt. If I was Riga, I would be looking at clubs who might want to sweeten a deal by loaning us players to help fill our gaps. It may not be possible, but you have to look at it. We are not staying up without another midfielder and with a combination of Lennon, Sarr, Wiliiams or Johnson.
I think we should let them off that one. Cardiff intended to buy Watt, and weren’t expecting it so understandable that we weren't either. It would probably be more reasonable to factor into the rules that it was Cardiff’s fault and shouldn’t restrict us. Having said that, Watt is a player we will need to stay up, unless we have given up. It would be a false economy not to factor in the cost of relegation, and Watt will still have a potential value in the summer. If he plays well for us, that value may even increase!
on this occasion I agree. Also, Cardiff didn't expect sanctions and are taking legal advice and may appeal as they believed they were within FFP rules, borne out by the fact they let Kenwyne Jones leave on loan so that has now left them short up front. Don't think we could have foreseen this a couple of months ago.
Agreed. And for as poorly as this club is run, we are not currently under a transfer embargo. This does not excuse the inability to staff a football club accordingly.
This is probably deserving of another thread, but one thing I think the regime is doing right is betting on FFP in the Football League being successful (don't agree with the way that they're conducting business to keep themselves under FFP regulations). What I think the Football League (unlike UEFA) is getting right is looking at the amount of debt clubs are incurring. I don't think transfer embargoes are the permanent answer, far from it, but it is at least a sign of intent that they do not want to see more clubs go the way of Portsmouth, Luton, insert numerous clubs here.
This is a problem that is at least a decade in the making, and I expect it will take that to unwind it. With the wealth gap between the Premier League and Champo widening further next year, things may well get better before they get worse. But at some point, English football as a whole (FL, PL, FA) have to come together to realize there is a huge spending and debt problem, and they need to find sustainable ways to address it.
If they did that, I think football would be healthier at all levels. But it is hard to get businesses that are set up to compete with each other to work together for the common good. The first thing they will look at is, will we gain or lose from this?
If they did that, I think football would be healthier at all levels. But it is hard to get businesses that are set up to compete with each other to work together for the common good. The first thing they will look at is, will we gain or lose from this?
My first thought was "you don't need to get the businesses (i.e. teams) involved, you can simply set mandates they have to follow." I then remembered the sad state of affairs that makes is so that the FL, PL, and FA are all in competition (to a certain extent) with each other.
I absolutely take your point, there is no easy answer here. It was five years ago that everyone was saying "it will take a big team going to the wall for things to change." Portsmouth did it, West Ham, Man City, Leeds, Palace, and others I can't think of off the top of my head came close.
I don't have answers but I do think one of the big issues at the heart of the conflict with RD and the supporters is how football clubs are run in England. RD's approach of "I'm going to do things my way and wait for the rest of the world to change" is a ridiculous way to run a business, but then so is the practice of pouring millions into a business with no discernible plan to regain the investment.
I will start another thread on this at some point, have to start my day job now of working with my current business on its stupid business practices and inability to manage finances.
'After signing Roger Johnson on an 18-month deal, bringing Diego Poyet back on a season-long loan from West Ham and snapping up Middlesbrough’s Rhys Williams on a temporary deal, Charlton need to bring down their spending'
I would like to nominate this sentence as the most depressing Charlton Athletic-related statement of the week please.
Katrien: "We need to offload Lookman so that we can afford to bolster our weak squad and avoid the drop." Riga: "No. Not selling Lookman. He scores goals we need to win games." Katrien: "But if we don't sell him, we can't afford to bring in a young player that will help us to score goals we need to win games." Riga: "But we already have a young player that scores goals that helps us to win games: Lookman." Katrien: "Ok. Let's agree to disagree. How about Harriott? I want to sell him so that we can bring in a young winger who will help us to feed the new young striker that will score goals to help us win games." Riga: "No. Not selling Harriott. He's a good young winger who will help us to feed the new young striker that will score goals to help us win games." Katrien: ""But if we don't sell him, we can't afford to bring in a young player that will help us to feed the new young striker that will score goals to help us win games." Riga: "But we already have a young player that will help us to feed the new young striker that will score goals that helps us to win games: Harriott." Katrien: "Ok. Let's agree to disagree. How about Watt? I want to sell him so that we can bring in another young striker that will score goals to help us win games." Riga: "No. Not selling Watt. He scores goals we need to win games." Katrien: "But if we don't sell him, we can't afford to bring in a young player that will help us to score goals we need to win games." Riga: "But we already have a young player that scores goals that helps us to win games: Watt." Katrien: "Ok. Let's agree to disagree. How about Sarr? Riga: "You can sell Sarr!" Katrien: "That's easy for you to say!"
I'm happy to have Watt stay. He's better than Mak and Reza for a start.
Whether or not you agree with the 'loan, 3 clubs' rule, it exists. It is there for all clubs to know, follow and adhere to.
If now, we find ourselves in trouble, because we hadn't realised the implications of this rule on the players we have shipped out on loan, you have to ask yourself, simply, why not?
Surely someone within CAFC is responsible for knowing who is where, who they can and cannot play for etc? If they don't, then that is the club's fault.
When Watt was sent out on loan to Cardiff whoever was responsible for arranging that (KM I assume), surely should have used a degree of common sense and looked into whether or not it was totally feasible for Cardiff to sign him at the end of or during the loan period. Would it have not been an idea to contact the FA and enquire as to whether or not Cardiff would be in a position to sign players in January? Is that not just part of the process of loaning players out to clubs - to first investigate whether or not that club is capable of actually signing players? Someone is ultimately responsible for sending a Charlton striker to a rival team on loan, denying us the opportunity to play him when we arguably needed him the most, for no real reason at all. Dreadful decision making once again. Demonstrates total incompetence.
I think we should let them off that one. Cardiff intended to buy Watt, and weren’t expecting it so understandable that we weren't either. It would probably be more reasonable to factor into the rules that it was Cardiff’s fault and shouldn’t restrict us. Having said that, Watt is a player we will need to stay up, unless we have given up. It would be a false economy not to factor in the cost of relegation, and Watt will still have a potential value in the summer. If he plays well for us, that value may even increase!
Why should they be let off? over the past few weeks we have needed Tony Watt. He wasn't available because the club were in such a rush to off-load him. Had the club done their homework, we may not be in this position now. It's the FA that have slapped a transfer embargo on Cardiff. They haven't just decided to do that, they would have known about that for some time. I'm not saying it's Cardiff's fault, but had Charlton carried out some simple homework the FA would have either said to Charlton, we see no reason why you cant loan the player to Cardiff and they are free to sign him if they want to.
Alternatively, they may have said, currently, Cardiff are permitted to sign players. Or they may have said, there is a current investigation taking place etc. etc. That should have set alarm bells ringing. Either way - we have rather naively lent a club one of our better players. He has done well for them, and now we find he is back. He doesn't want to be back. The club clearly don't want him back and he cant be loaned out to another club? It's a ridiculous position to be in and will not pan out well and could have been avoided in my opinion had someone done a bit of research.
Katrien: "We need to offload Lookman so that we can afford to bolster our weak squad and avoid the drop." Riga: "No. Not selling Lookman. He scores goals we need to win games." Katrien: "But if we don't sell him, we can't afford to bring in a young player that will help us to score goals we need to win games." Riga: "But we already have a young player that scores goals that helps us to win games: Lookman." Katrien: "Ok. Let's agree to disagree. How about Harriott? I want to sell him so that we can bring in a young winger who will help us to feed the new young striker that will score goals to help us win games." Riga: "No. Not selling Harriott. He's a good young winger who will help us to feed the new young striker that will score goals to help us win games." Katrien: ""But if we don't sell him, we can't afford to bring in a young player that will help us to feed the new young striker that will score goals to help us win games." Riga: "But we already have a young player that will help us to feed the new young striker that will score goals that helps us to win games: Harriott." Katrien: "Ok. Let's agree to disagree. How about Watt? I want to sell him so that we can bring in another young striker that will score goals to help us win games." Riga: "No. Not selling Watt. He scores goals we need to win games." Katrien: "But if we don't sell him, we can't afford to bring in a young player that will help us to score goals we need to win games." Riga: "But we already have a young player that scores goals that helps us to win games: Watt." Katrien: "Ok. Let's agree to disagree. How about Sarr? Riga: "You can sell Sarr!" Katrien: "That's easy for you to say!"</</b>blockquote>
Here's an idea Katrien, keep your best players at the club and get them to help you stay up and shift some of the dross like Reza, Sarr, Williams and Ba instead.
"After signing Roger Johnson on an 18-month deal, bringing Diego Poyet back on a season-long loan from West Ham and snapping up Middlesbrough’s Rhys Williams on a temporary deal, Charlton need to bring down their spending."
How much did those three cost? One one-month loan of a player who seems to have been signed based on his Wikipedia page, and two who were got rid of but are now deemed just the right fit. One until May. The other, God help us, for another 17 months and two weeks. I know about balancing books but this hardly makes me confident ...
Here's an idea Katrien, keep your best players at the club and get them to help you stay up and shift some of the dross like Reza, Sarr, Williams and Ba instead.
All well and good, but you know if she offloads them they'll be back on loan or with an extended contract next January.
"After signing Roger Johnson on an 18-month deal, bringing Diego Poyet back on a season-long loan from West Ham and snapping up Middlesbrough’s Rhys Williams on a temporary deal, Charlton need to bring down their spending."
"After signing Roger Johnson on an 18-month deal, bringing Diego Poyet back on a season-long loan from West Ham and snapping up Middlesbrough’s Rhys Williams on a temporary deal, Charlton need to bring down their spending."
Comments
This is probably deserving of another thread, but one thing I think the regime is doing right is betting on FFP in the Football League being successful (don't agree with the way that they're conducting business to keep themselves under FFP regulations). What I think the Football League (unlike UEFA) is getting right is looking at the amount of debt clubs are incurring. I don't think transfer embargoes are the permanent answer, far from it, but it is at least a sign of intent that they do not want to see more clubs go the way of Portsmouth, Luton, insert numerous clubs here.
This is a problem that is at least a decade in the making, and I expect it will take that to unwind it. With the wealth gap between the Premier League and Champo widening further next year, things may well get better before they get worse. But at some point, English football as a whole (FL, PL, FA) have to come together to realize there is a huge spending and debt problem, and they need to find sustainable ways to address it.
Okay, off my soap box now.
I absolutely take your point, there is no easy answer here. It was five years ago that everyone was saying "it will take a big team going to the wall for things to change." Portsmouth did it, West Ham, Man City, Leeds, Palace, and others I can't think of off the top of my head came close.
I don't have answers but I do think one of the big issues at the heart of the conflict with RD and the supporters is how football clubs are run in England. RD's approach of "I'm going to do things my way and wait for the rest of the world to change" is a ridiculous way to run a business, but then so is the practice of pouring millions into a business with no discernible plan to regain the investment.
I will start another thread on this at some point, have to start my day job now of working with my current business on its stupid business practices and inability to manage finances.
I would like to nominate this sentence as the most depressing Charlton Athletic-related statement of the week please.
Riga: "No. Not selling Lookman. He scores goals we need to win games."
Katrien: "But if we don't sell him, we can't afford to bring in a young player that will help us to score goals we need to win games."
Riga: "But we already have a young player that scores goals that helps us to win games: Lookman."
Katrien: "Ok. Let's agree to disagree. How about Harriott? I want to sell him so that we can bring in a young winger who will help us to feed the new young striker that will score goals to help us win games."
Riga: "No. Not selling Harriott. He's a good young winger who will help us to feed the new young striker that will score goals to help us win games."
Katrien: ""But if we don't sell him, we can't afford to bring in a young player that will help us to feed the new young striker that will score goals to help us win games."
Riga: "But we already have a young player that will help us to feed the new young striker that will score goals that helps us to win games: Harriott."
Katrien: "Ok. Let's agree to disagree. How about Watt? I want to sell him so that we can bring in another young striker that will score goals to help us win games."
Riga: "No. Not selling Watt. He scores goals we need to win games."
Katrien: "But if we don't sell him, we can't afford to bring in a young player that will help us to score goals we need to win games."
Riga: "But we already have a young player that scores goals that helps us to win games: Watt."
Katrien: "Ok. Let's agree to disagree. How about Sarr?
Riga: "You can sell Sarr!"
Katrien: "That's easy for you to say!"
Alternatively, they may have said, currently, Cardiff are permitted to sign players. Or they may have said, there is a current investigation taking place etc. etc. That should have set alarm bells ringing. Either way - we have rather naively lent a club one of our better players. He has done well for them, and now we find he is back. He doesn't want to be back. The club clearly don't want him back and he cant be loaned out to another club? It's a ridiculous position to be in and will not pan out well and could have been avoided in my opinion had someone done a bit of research.
"After signing Roger Johnson on an 18-month deal, bringing Diego Poyet back on a season-long loan from West Ham and snapping up Middlesbrough’s Rhys Williams on a temporary deal, Charlton need to bring down their spending."
How much did those three cost? One one-month loan of a player who seems to have been signed based on his Wikipedia page, and two who were got rid of but are now deemed just the right fit. One until May. The other, God help us, for another 17 months and two weeks. I know about balancing books but this hardly makes me confident ...