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Jimmy Seed

Brief mention of Jimmy Seed on the last page of today's Guardian sports section. Article by Barry Glendenning recounts how he was released by Sunderland after being gassed in WW1 but going on to be a winner as a player with Spurs, Wednesday and England.
Article inspired by visit to theNational Football Museum in Manchester where there is a Greater Game Exhibition.

Comments

  • Has he been sacked as our Manager?
  • Many years ago there was a TV dramatisation of his early days at Sunderland, his war time gassing, his attempt to get back his form on returning to Sunderland, before being thrown out. Think he went to play non-league in Wales to finally achieve recuperation. Played alongside great Sunderland legend Charlie Buchan who went on to publish great footie mag Charlie Buchan's Football Monthly.

    Jimmy died in Orpington Hospital, a mate of mine was in the same ward and he said there was a real lack of visitors for Jimmy's last days.

  • We should name a stand after himAlan Curbishley

    Corrected that for you.
    Just because you were hanging out with him over the summer.
  • Is it me or should RD not change a few seats next summer and put up a new Jimmy Seed Stand sign instead?

  • We have the Jimmy seed.(south)
    how about Alan Curbishley(east)
    The Lennie Lawrence (West)
    and instead of the covered end being named after one of our
    CL regulars. How about the Guy Luzon Stand ?
    What too early ? :neutral:
  • C_A_F_C said:

    We should name a stand after himAlan Curbishley

    Corrected that for you.
    Just because you were hanging out of him over the summer.
    :neutral:
  • We should name a stand after himAlan Curbishley

    Corrected that for you.
    when he retires
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  • Has he been sacked as our Manager?

    Yep, Curbishley 14/1
  • Good name for an exhibition and mentioning Jimmy Seed, wonder where they got it from,

    The Greater Game: Sporting Icons Who Fell in the Great War http://www.amazon.co.uk/The-Greater-Game-Sporting-Icons/dp/1844157628 (Share from CM Browser)

    #notbitter
  • We have the Jimmy seed.(south)
    how about Alan Curbishley(east)
    The Lennie Lawrence (West)
    and instead of the covered end being named after one of our
    CL regulars. How about the Guy Luzon Stand ?
    What too early ? :neutral:

    How about naming the toilets are Ian Dowie
  • We have the Jimmy seed.(south)
    how about Alan Curbishley(east)
    The Lennie Lawrence (West)
    and instead of the covered end being named after one of our
    CL regulars. How about the Guy Luzon Stand ?
    What too early ? :neutral:

    How about naming the toilets are Ian Dowie
    The Dowie dump house ?
    The Peeters Pisser ?
    The Craggs Khasi ?

    Or The Les Reed Restroom ?

    Well he was a very good number 2 :blush:

  • Tramp said:

    Many years ago there was a TV dramatisation of his early days at Sunderland, his war time gassing, his attempt to get back his form on returning to Sunderland, before being thrown out. Think he went to play non-league in Wales to finally achieve recuperation. Played alongside great Sunderland legend Charlie Buchan who went on to publish great footie mag Charlie Buchan's Football Monthly.

    Jimmy died in Orpington Hospital, a mate of mine was in the same ward and he said there was a real lack of visitors for Jimmy's last days.

    I was at boarding school at the time, but he wasn't in hospital because he was ill, he was there for an operation. I believe he never came round from the anaesthetic.
    I'm sure if he was there for a serious illness he would have had plenty of vistors.
    My mum couldn't remember what the operation was for when I asked her about fifteen years ago (early stages of dementia). She told me when I was much younger, but I've forgotten too.
    I'm going have to get a copy of his death certificate.
  • Stig said:

    Extract from an article I wrote for CASTrust:

    Jimmy Seed is arguably Charlton's greatest ever manager; certainly he's the one that's enjoyed the most success. And yet it is quite possible that if it hadn't been for the war, his and the club's paths might never have crossed. In 1914 Seed was a young professional playing for Sunderland reserves and hoping for a chance in the Rokerites first team. By the time he was 20 he had joined the army as a signaller and travelled to the continent with the 8th Battalion, West Yorkshire Regiment.

    During the night of 21st-22nd July 1917, whilst Seed and his comrades were sleeping in cellars beneath some bombed out buildings in Ostend, the Germans bombarded the area with shells containing a new and deadly weapon; dichlorethyl sulfide, more commonly known as mustard gas. This was just 11 days after this horrific weapon had first been used. Although Seed would have known of the dangers, there was little he could do as one of the effects of the gas was to induce vomiting which meant that it wasn't possible for the men to keep their respirators on. 803 men, presumably including Seed, were admitted to hospital as a result of the attack. Over the next three weeks, 96 of them died. The mortality rate from a mustard gas attack in the open is usually about 2%. In the dank cellars where Seed and the others had sought shelter it was six times that, as there was nowhere for the gas to disperse.

    The symptoms of a mustard gas attack include conjunctivitis, temporary blindness, photophobia, skin ulcers, bronchitis and in extreme cases bronchopneumonia. It takes a long time for even the fittest of men to recover, and so it did for Jimmy. After the war he returned to the north east and turned out one more time for Sunderland's reserves. In poor health, he played badly and the club decided that his footballing days were over. To help resurrect his career, Seed signed for Mid-Rhonda in the Southern League, Second Division. He helped them to win their league and went on to play for Spurs, Sheffield Wednesday and England. After two years managing Clapton Orient, he was invited by the Glicksten brothers to take charge of Charlton. The rest, as they say, is history. But it might not have been. If it hadn't been for the war, it is likely that Seed would have progressed to Sunderland's first team. From there his career may well have taken a very different path. He might never have met the Glickstens; the ground breaking successive promotions, the 20 years as a top flight club and victory in the FA cup might never have happened.

    Our Jimmy was not the only Seed to see action during WWI. His brother Angus, a member of the 17th Middlesex "Footballers' Battalion", was awarded the Military Medal for bravery at Vimy Ridge. A German shell exploded burying up to ten men in a shower of mud. Whilst the battle carried on Seed dug Tom Ratcliff free, quite possibly saving his life. At the time Ratcliff was Arsenal's assistant trainer, but in a nice twist to the story when Angus Seed later managed Barnsley, Ratcliff was appointed the job of trainer there.

    You, may be wondering what this has to do with Charlton. Is it just the tenuous link that Angus and Jimmy were brothers? Well no, actually there's more to it than that, because it was actually Angus' scouting skills that first brought Sam Bartram to Jimmy Seed's attention. If it hadn't been for Angus we might never have got our greatest ever player. 900 of the Footballers Battalion lost their lives during the war, some in the same action where Angus Seed earned his bravery award. If things had panned out a little differently, Charlton would have been significantly worse off.

    Luckily both of the Seed brothers survived the war and went on to have prolonged managerial careers. Jimmy's 23 seasons at Charlton makes him the 20th longest serving manager in English football. Whilst Angus' 16 seasons with The Tykes puts him 57th on the list.

    Really nice aticle. Your point that without the war Jimmy may not have met the Glickstens was interesting. But of course, there were many twists and turns that led him to become manager of Orient, which in turn led him to be sitting Albert Glicksten at an Arsenal dinner. It was only because Clapton Orient followed Charlton alphabetically that they sat next to each other.

    Angus was the brother who looked after Jimmy in schoolboy football, and Angus follwed Jimmy's path playing for Mid Rhondda after Jimmy was signed by Spurs.
    But it was Anthony Seed who ran the scouting operation from the north east of England, which is where he discovered Sam, on 30th March 1934, playing for Boldon Villa in a league challenge cup final. Sam was a left half, but a frustrated goalkeeper at heart. He had been switched to goalkeeper for the final due to an injury to the regular keeper.
  • Stig said:

    Extract from an article I wrote for CASTrust:


    During the night of 21st-22nd July 1917, whilst Seed and his comrades were sleeping in cellars beneath some bombed out buildings in Ostend, the Germans bombarded the area with shells containing a new and deadly weapon; dichlorethyl sulfide, more commonly known as mustard gas. This was just 11 days after this horrific weapon had first been used. Although Seed would have known of the dangers, there was little he could do as one of the effects of the gas was to induce vomiting which meant that it wasn't possible for the men to keep their respirators on. 803 men, presumably including Seed, were admitted to hospital as a result of the attack. Over the next three weeks, 96 of them died. The mortality rate from a mustard gas attack in the open is usually about 2%. In the dank cellars where Seed and the others had sought shelter it was six times that, as there was nowhere for the gas to disperse.

    The symptoms of a mustard gas attack include conjunctivitis, temporary blindness, photophobia, skin ulcers, bronchitis and in extreme cases bronchopneumonia. It takes a long time for even the fittest of men to recover, and so it did for Jimmy. After the war he returned to the north east and turned out one more time for Sunderland's reserves.

    Jimmy Seed actually returned to the front line after recovering from the Belgium gassing, only to be gassed again at Valenciennes, just before the end of the conflict.
  • JamesSeed said:

    ...It was only because Clapton Orient followed Charlton alphabetically that they sat next to each other...

    So if they'd have been using one of their other names 'Leyton Orient' or just 'Orient', our history may have been wildly different.
  • Stig said:

    JamesSeed said:

    ...It was only because Clapton Orient followed Charlton alphabetically that they sat next to each other...

    So if they'd have been using one of their other names 'Leyton Orient' or just 'Orient', our history may have been wildly different.
    Yup. They were Clapton, before Leyton of course.
    If Chogham FC had been invited we'd have been in trouble.
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  • Didn't know that about Jimmy Seed. Every day is a school day
  • Swisdom said:

    Didn't know that about Jimmy Seed. Every day is a school day

    Which bit?
  • Tramp said:

    Many years ago there was a TV dramatisation of his early days at Sunderland, his war time gassing, his attempt to get back his form on returning to Sunderland, before being thrown out. Think he went to play non-league in Wales to finally achieve recuperation. Played alongside great Sunderland legend Charlie Buchan who went on to publish great footie mag Charlie Buchan's Football Monthly.

    Jimmy died in Orpington Hospital, a mate of mine was in the same ward and he said there was a real lack of visitors for Jimmy's last days.

    Oh btw, he was in hospital for an operation to remove his gall bladder. He suffered heart failure during the operation. According to the death certificate, this was due to high blood pressure.
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