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People pulling out of property transactions

I am interested to see what the general views and opinions are on this board as I am guessing we will have people who have had experience on both sides of the fence.

As happens a lot, my Dad has just had someone pull out (for the 3rd time in fact) as he is ready to exchange on a house purchase and sale of his house. A generally emotional time anyway as he prepares to start afresh in a new home after Mum died a couple of years or so ago.

In this example, the guy selling didn't have the decency to phone and explain what had happened and why. He just 'doesnt want to sell anymore'. The Estate Agent cant get hold of him, and apparently his solicitor cant get hold of him. My Dad has obviously lost all his survey fees (for the 3rd time), and a chunk of legal fees I guess. And to make matters worse, for reason unknown to me, a young family near the foot of the chain exchanged yesterday - a day ahead of my Dad (I personally cant see how that could work - I thought the whole chain went together) and so are now apparently facing being 'homeless' at Christmas. With 2 kids.

I remember I was utterly livid when it happened to me.

My question is - do you think Mr A. Hole at the top of the chain should be liable for everyone's costs down the chain bearing in mind he has pulled out a day ahead of exchange? Unless somebody can come up with a damn good reason (financial circumstances have changed etc) I think they should be forced to cover the thousands of pounds that they have cost everyone.

Thoughts?
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Comments

  • edited December 2014
    When selling you should be obliged to take out insurance to cover the costs of everyone in the chain if you break it.

    In answer to your question, yes he should be liable 100%. Git.
  • Someone needs to be liable, my mum just finally moved after 3 years of broken deals.. The stress really isn't fair
  • I put in an offer on a house and the survey came back with some pretty serious flaws and made it pretty clear that the seller had been trying to hide them so I had no qualms about pulling out. On the other hand, when we were buying our house, I was told by the agent on the day before exchange that there was a very significant chance that the vendor would not go through with the sale, simply because she changed her mind. Fortunately she eventually decided to go ahead. The stress of that whole process made me physically ill.

    The house buying system in this country is nothing less than an utter disgrace. Up until the point of exchange, anyone in the chain can pull out for any reason with no comeback. Making or accepting an offer on a property should be legally binding other than for certain, strictly controlled, specified reasons. I believe that Scotland has such a system in place so why not us?

    I'm at the point now where I am extremely reluctant to move house, mainly due to the stresses of the system. I am fortunate that we have an end of terrace and have room to extend but if we didn't I don't know what I'd do.
  • I have pulled out twice, both times due to redundancy, I think the idea of taking out a form of insurance is a good one.

    I worked with a guy - (Bastard) - who would take a purchase to the edge and then pull out and then a relative would come in and make a low offer which they needed to to take. Now that is immoral!!
  • edited December 2014
    Kap10 said:

    I have pulled out twice, both times due to redundancy, I think the idea of taking out a form of insurance is a good one.

    I worked with a guy - (Bastard) - who would take a purchase to the edge and then pull out and then a relative would come in and make a low offer which they needed to to take. Now that is immoral!!

    That must be bordering on illegal!! Or should be.

    Insurance is a good idea
  • Insurance would be a good idea. I think also that so many purchases fall through on the basis that the buyer couldn't actually achieve a mortgage it ought to be a requirement to have one approved in principle before a bid can be made.

    I had someone pull out on buying my house earlier this year, suddenly decided she didn't want to live in the area. Fair enough I thought, that's why I was moving. Cost me time and money though, as I'd taken the house off the market and turned down other bids that couldn't be resurrected.
  • I got screwed by actress and celebrity chef Lisa Faulkner, and not in a good way. The chain was all sorted, surveys done, then she drifted off and made an offer on a different house. She'd already done it to someone else when she made the offer on ours, so it shouldn't have come as a surprise.
  • what Algarve said
  • edited December 2014
    I have also been on the receiving end of this in the past and whilst morally the perpetrators are probably scum legally they have done nothing wrong.

    A change to the law is difficult because, particularly in the present economic climate, there are a host of genuine reasons such as redundancy, withdrawal of mortgage, relationship breakdown etc, etc why someone may need to pull out before exchange given that the process from offer to that point often takes months.

    They say that buying and selling property is second only to bereavement on the stress list and I can well believe it.
  • if someone at the bottom exchanged they havn't really as you all need to exchange on the same day so when everyone is ready to exchange they will exchange again. what probably happened is they exchanged and then their solicitor couldn't get hold of the next solicitor up the chain.
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  • edited December 2014
    Afraid the law has always in England been inadequate. When I worked on a property magazine years ago I understand that after exchange of contracts you lost your deposit, if either party withdrew in Scotland. Of course if the vendor or buyer fail to disclose, hide or god forbid it lie about a disclosure, i.e. no electricity certificate, central heating not maintained by a gas safe engineer, or planning permission, you could I assume bring a civil case to reclaim these amounts. Obviously the courts would decide if this was possible. As it happens, one of my sons has just had a structural survey completed with a house he is buying. 9 points were raised, regarding further information required. The report concluded the house was valued for the mortgage they hoped to obtain. 5 of the points were simply because they could not at the time produce the evidence,( the owners were not actually there) but have assured the solicitor they have the paperwork?. We have instructed the solicitor to seek written assurances, and will proceed if for instance the small fence panels are replaced as was agreed. Currently there are posts, but no panels.

    I have noticed that most house selling is somewhat of a 'dark art', and the survey even at 'structural' does not include drains or the boiler. I think this can be obtained at a further cost. The house buyers report that banks use, seems just to cover the aspect of wether the property is worth the valuation/mortgage and rebuilding costs.

    The so called EPC certificate introduced by Cooper, in the last labour goverment was supposed to speed up the process, although in my opinion it now takes longer for the deals to be completed.

    For most people this is a major financial outlay, you would think that HM Goverment would afford people at least some protection against this type of behaviour. Buyer beware.

    Personally I am astonished that as a nation obsessed with house prices/ we do not have a fair system in place in 2014 that stops liars and individuals trying to protect people with legitimate complaints.


  • if someone at the bottom exchanged they havn't really as you all need to exchange on the same day so when everyone is ready to exchange they will exchange again. what probably happened is they exchanged and then their solicitor couldn't get hold of the next solicitor up the chain.

    Yeah that's what I thought.
  • Some legal eagles may disagree, but I presume there's nothing to stop a seller asking a buyer (having made an accepted offer) to sign a contract indemnifying them for any direct costs should they not complete on the transaction.

    It would quickly sort out those who were serious and those who were playing games.
  • LenGlover said:

    I have also been on the receiving end of this in the past and whilst morally the perpetrators are probably scum legally they have done nothing wrong.

    A change to the law is difficult because, particularly in the present economic climate, there are a host of genuine reasons such as redundancy, withdrawal of mortgage, relationship breakdown etc, etc why someone may need to pull out before exchange given that the process from offer to that point often takes months.

    They say that buying and selling property is second only to bereavement on the stress list and I can well believe it.

    I don't think anyone reasonable would have an issue with genuine reasons. How often is a mortgage offer withdrawn though?
  • rikofold said:

    LenGlover said:

    I have also been on the receiving end of this in the past and whilst morally the perpetrators are probably scum legally they have done nothing wrong.

    A change to the law is difficult because, particularly in the present economic climate, there are a host of genuine reasons such as redundancy, withdrawal of mortgage, relationship breakdown etc, etc why someone may need to pull out before exchange given that the process from offer to that point often takes months.

    They say that buying and selling property is second only to bereavement on the stress list and I can well believe it.

    I don't think anyone reasonable would have an issue with genuine reasons. How often is a mortgage offer withdrawn though?
    It is possible to have an offer of a mortgage in principle, as you mention higher up the thread, but have it withdrawn once the survey has been carried out for whatever reason.
  • Many years ago we agreed to buy a house, the moving date was set.
    About one week before the moving date my wife and I visited the couple to discuss a payment for some curtains that were not part of the house sale.
    To our amazement the guy told us he could not move on the agreed day as he could not get the day off work.
    We contacted our solicitor who told us that he had to move on the day (Friday) as moneys for the purchase would be exchanged on that day.
    After many phone calls between solicitors it became apparent that the man was not going to move on the agreed date.
    Our solicitor advised us to move on the day – arrive at his house and await entry and telephone confirmation from the solicitor that the deal had been completed.
    We followed instructions and arrived at the house but were denied entry.
    To cut a very long story short – the daft bloke ended up paying for overnight storage and insurance of our furniture and overnight accommodation for my wife and I.
    He also incurred costs for our and his solicitors to complete the paperwork on Saturday.
    Oh the joy of moving house.
  • I pulled out of a deal, I had signed contracts (but not exchanged them) and was 2/3 weeks from completion.
    The estate agent was a bit miffed, shame. It didnt really impact on the seller to much the house was quite a nice one and was quickly bought by someone else.
    It cost me for all the work my solicitor had done plus the normal things. I was able to sell on the the searches and the parish church repair insurance con thing.
    I'm sure some would say I didn't behave correctly but I had been strung along for months by a greedy home owner and an estate agent who could never find my telephone number to return a call and generally behaved like a 1980's yuppie. (one in Chislehurst near the pond)
  • I got badly let down by a building society who right at the last knockings decided they wouldn't lend us the money. They admitted their mistake and paid back all my costs. I think the manager who agreed our loan was sacked. It's only reading this thread now that I wonder what effect my pulling out had on other people in the chain, but it was totally out of my hands.


  • Personally I am astonished that as a nation obsessed with house prices/ we do not have a fair system in place in 2014 that stops liars and individuals trying to protect people with legitimate complaints.


    Beacause we have an economic system that is based on the best liars getting the most money. What would happen if we made everything fair? Are you some kind of commie pinko?
    Quite possibly, as both my Grandfather, and father were !
    I am sure some of there political ideas have rubbed off on me, and unlike quite a few of the lot on here I was born in Charlton, and lived within the roar of the Valley, on the council estate at the top of the hill.
    I could assume that you think I believe that 'Karl Marx famously asserted that property is theft [actually, I'm told the original of this was Pierre-Joseph Proudhon in 1843 in What is Property?' but when has a fact ever got in the way of a prejudiced point of view?




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  • I am very pleased I have no intention of buying or selling for some years to come
  • On the flip side, we had to pull out of two houses that surveys showed up issues the sellers were blatantly trying to cover up - we incurred survey costs, solicitors fees etc and were back to square one (3rd time lucky I hope as we have now exchanged and are moving on Monday) - should the seller be responsible for those fees given they knew about those issues?

    It's a messed up and expensive process, Algarve's insurance point is a good one.
  • Really wishing I hadn't read this thread seeing as I'm supposed to be completing next Thursday, let's just hope no one in the chain pulls out! It's stressful enough as it is .
  • bobcafc7 said:

    Really wishing I hadn't read this thread seeing as I'm supposed to be completing next Thursday, let's just hope no one in the chain pulls out! It's stressful enough as it is .

    If you've got past the exchange and are waiting on completion then you at least have a degree of comeback if it goes tits up. Prior to exchange you have nothing.

  • Rizzo said:

    bobcafc7 said:

    Really wishing I hadn't read this thread seeing as I'm supposed to be completing next Thursday, let's just hope no one in the chain pulls out! It's stressful enough as it is .

    If you've got past the exchange and are waiting on completion then you at least have a degree of comeback if it goes tits up. Prior to exchange you have nothing.

    and you have the comfort of knowing it'll be hard for them to sell to someone else if all the windows are broken...
  • Rizzo said:

    bobcafc7 said:

    Really wishing I hadn't read this thread seeing as I'm supposed to be completing next Thursday, let's just hope no one in the chain pulls out! It's stressful enough as it is .

    If you've got past the exchange and are waiting on completion then you at least have a degree of comeback if it goes tits up. Prior to exchange you have nothing.

    Fingers crossed it will all be ok , it was more to do with the point I hadn't really thought about it falling through/ getting delayed until I read about the amount of people on here that's pulled out ect lol , I'm sure it will be fine.
  • I pulled out of a deal, I had signed contracts (but not exchanged them) and was 2/3 weeks from completion.
    The estate agent was a bit miffed, shame. It didnt really impact on the seller to much the house was quite a nice one and was quickly bought by someone else.
    It cost me for all the work my solicitor had done plus the normal things. I was able to sell on the the searches and the parish church repair insurance con thing.
    I'm sure some would say I didn't behave correctly but I had been strung along for months by a greedy home owner and an estate agent who could never find my telephone number to return a call and generally behaved like a 1980's yuppie. (one in Chislehurst near the pond)

    Bit confused here CK - what was your exact reason for pulling out?
  • I pulled out of a deal, I had signed contracts (but not exchanged them) and was 2/3 weeks from completion.
    The estate agent was a bit miffed, shame. It didnt really impact on the seller to much the house was quite a nice one and was quickly bought by someone else.
    It cost me for all the work my solicitor had done plus the normal things. I was able to sell on the the searches and the parish church repair insurance con thing.
    I'm sure some would say I didn't behave correctly but I had been strung along for months by a greedy home owner and an estate agent who could never find my telephone number to return a call and generally behaved like a 1980's yuppie. (one in Chislehurst near the pond)

    Bit confused here CK - what was your exact reason for pulling out?
    I was about to ask the same thing.
  • On the flip side, we had to pull out of two houses that surveys showed up issues the sellers were blatantly trying to cover up - we incurred survey costs, solicitors fees etc and were back to square one (3rd time lucky I hope as we have now exchanged and are moving on Monday) - should the seller be responsible for those fees given they knew about those issues?

    It's a messed up and expensive process, Algarve's insurance point is a good one.

    Absolutely.

    In the scenarios where the survey showed up issues, surely this would be apparent quite some time before the point of exchange though, which was the point at which Damo's Dad was let down?
  • edited December 2014
    Interesting reading through the responses and experiences.

    In Dad's case, there don't seem to be any special circumstances. The guy has just buggered off and is not answering any calls leaving the whole chain in limbo. All the Estate Agent can say is 'deal is off' essentially.

    Dad is stuck between a rock and a hard place. He really doesnt want the family with kids further down the chain in this situation around Christmas, and wanted to consider moving in to rented and completing the chain with him as he doesnt need a mortgage and is a cash buyer.

    Problem with that is that at the rate house prices are going up, he could end up losing a (relative amount) in the region of £50k easily if it takes a while to find something. He may end up doing that though, I think.
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