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Does this add up?

- You have a mid-table League One club that has finished lower than the previous season for 7 straight years. You have to build a completely new squad and somehow make them gel instantly. You pull it off in emphatic style, winning the title with a record points tally.

- The following summer the club begins to go into meltdown off the pitch and after buying just one player, a right-sided utility man, all other purchases are called off. You can only add free transfers and loanees to a League One squad. But you nearly take this team to the play-offs in its first season at this level.

- Yet more uncertainty the next summer. No contracts for key players whose deals are expiring, and indeed your own. With only free transfers and loans available, you are left with just one senior striker 2 days before the new season before two out-of-favour forwards are hastily drafted in to fill the squad.

- The squad is again competitive despite constant off-field rumours, uncertainty, and unhappiness. Under a new owner, you then have to sell your top scorer and talisman, as well as the core playmaker of your team, currently enjoying his best ever form for the club. You can replace them with foreign loans who know little of English football, and you know little of them.

- You make some poor tactical decisions, like good managers do every week across the divisions, like one of the club's greatest ever managers did not long ago - often to to the great anger of supporters. But despite having no choice but to rely on two academy players at the very heart of the side, both in their first season of senior football, and having your player of the season for two consecutive seasons almost permanently sidelined, and still going without a notable striker, you stay competitive and nearly reach an FA Cup semi-final.

And now you should be sacked?
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Comments

  • You can't live on past glories in football unfortunately. Everything you say is correct, but you have to make the most of what you have. IMO Powell has had a very bad season in this respect. He could have, should have, done some things very differently. From the outset his football has been too negative and one dimensional. We should not have found ourselves flirting with the relegation places with the squad we had in the first half of the season. Our squad was no worse than mid table teams like Bournmouth or Brighton, yet because of our lowly position, they have snapped up two of our best players. Yann scored only 8 all season with us, yet scores 3 in his first full game for Bournmouth. Our poor style of football has meant that we haven't created nearly enough chances. Harriot has been involved in most of our forward action recently, yet Powell has refused to play him for most of the season. Cousins positive impact on the midfield has been negated by playing him wide. Wilson's good form on the right midfield was negated by pushing him back (should have got in a loan RB). Everything has been geared to not loosing rather than playing good football and trying to score goals. The strategy has been, first contain, then try to nick a goal, then defend it. It's a very negative strategy that has permeated the players and the supporters. It sends out the message that we are not good enough to compete. Our players are far better than that and it's no wonder that their spirits seem to be very low ATM.
  • You can't live on past glories in football unfortunately. Everything you say is correct, but you have to make the most of what you have. IMO Powell has had a very bad season in this respect. He could have, should have, done some things very differently. From the outset his football has been too negative and one dimensional. We should not have found ourselves flirting with the relegation places with the squad we had in the first half of the season. Our squad was no worse than mid table teams like Bournmouth or Brighton, yet because of our lowly position, they have snapped up two of our best players. Yann scored only 8 all season with us, yet scores 3 in his first full game for Bournmouth. Our poor style of football has meant that we haven't created nearly enough chances. Harriot has been involved in most of our forward action recently, yet Powell has refused to play him for most of the season. Cousins positive impact on the midfield has been negated by playing him wide. Wilson's good form on the right midfield was negated by pushing him back (should have got in a loan RB). Everything has been geared to not loosing rather than playing good football and trying to score goals. The strategy has been, first contain, then try to nick a goal, then defend it. It's a very negative strategy that has permeated the players and the supporters. It sends out the message that we are not good enough to compete. Our players are far better than that and it's no wonder that their spirits seem to be very low ATM.

    I've liked this and also emphatically quoted it. Totally agree. The Sheff Utd game epitomized this perfectly.
  • - You have a mid-table League One club that has finished lower than the previous season for 7 straight years. You have to build a completely new squad and somehow make them gel instantly. You pull it off in emphatic style, winning the title with a record points tally.

    - The following summer the club begins to go into meltdown off the pitch and after buying just one player, a right-sided utility man, all other purchases are called off. You can only add free transfers and loanees to a League One squad. But you nearly take this team to the play-offs in its first season at this level.

    - Yet more uncertainty the next summer. No contracts for key players whose deals are expiring, and indeed your own. With only free transfers and loans available, you are left with just one senior striker 2 days before the new season before two out-of-favour forwards are hastily drafted in to fill the squad.

    - The squad is again competitive despite constant off-field rumours, uncertainty, and unhappiness. Under a new owner, you then have to sell your top scorer and talisman, as well as the core playmaker of your team, currently enjoying his best ever form for the club. You can replace them with foreign loans who know little of English football, and you know little of them.

    - You make some poor tactical decisions, like good managers do every week across the divisions, like one of the club's greatest ever managers did not long ago - often to to the great anger of supporters. But despite having no choice but to rely on two academy players at the very heart of the side, both in their first season of senior football, and having your player of the season for two consecutive seasons almost permanently sidelined, and still going without a notable striker, you stay competitive and nearly reach an FA Cup semi-final.

    And now you should be sacked?

    Without a notable striker?
    What's church and sordell then?
    Apart from being crap that is!

  • I don't think our players are far better than that , centre of midfield or right wing Cousins couldn't trap a bag of cement yesterday, Harriott puts that chance away and it's a different conversation taking place on here , fine margins
    All this hindsight bollox , I thought with , Harriott , Church and Tudgay on the pitch today that was attacking enough
    We were shit and the sad thing is Sheff Utd were shit as well

    But it's not just about having Church, Tudgay and Harriott on the pitch though. Our midfield where offence should start were playing so deep it was negative to the ultimate degree. Diego Poyet who I think is very good was virtually playing as a third centre back. Church and Tudgay were isolated and therefore ineffective. Seeing Jordan Cousins struggling out wide right is just painful. I don't at the moment understand Powell's thought process. Is there any Charlton fan that thinks JC can or should be playing there ?

    We must be more offensively minded than in recent weeks if we are to have any hope of getting out of the bottom three. Ajdarevic must start. Wilson must play right midfield with either Cousins or Nego behind him and Church must be dropped in favour of Reza who given his short time playing at least knows how to get a shot on target.

    If we don't get three points at least from the next two then I think that's it. Millwall at The Den is a traditional embarrassment so we had better damn well win on Wednesday.

  • - You have a mid-table League One club that has finished lower than the previous season for 7 straight years. You have to build a completely new squad and somehow make them gel instantly. You pull it off in emphatic style, winning the title with a record points tally.

    - The following summer the club begins to go into meltdown off the pitch and after buying just one player, a right-sided utility man, all other purchases are called off. You can only add free transfers and loanees to a League One squad. But you nearly take this team to the play-offs in its first season at this level.

    - Yet more uncertainty the next summer. No contracts for key players whose deals are expiring, and indeed your own. With only free transfers and loans available, you are left with just one senior striker 2 days before the new season before two out-of-favour forwards are hastily drafted in to fill the squad.

    - The squad is again competitive despite constant off-field rumours, uncertainty, and unhappiness. Under a new owner, you then have to sell your top scorer and talisman, as well as the core playmaker of your team, currently enjoying his best ever form for the club. You can replace them with foreign loans who know little of English football, and you know little of them.

    - You make some poor tactical decisions, like good managers do every week across the divisions, like one of the club's greatest ever managers did not long ago - often to to the great anger of supporters. But despite having no choice but to rely on two academy players at the very heart of the side, both in their first season of senior football, and having your player of the season for two consecutive seasons almost permanently sidelined, and still going without a notable striker, you stay competitive and nearly reach an FA Cup semi-final.

    And now you should be sacked?

    I would save the 'remaining competitive' part until after the next two matches, I fear 'nearly reaching an FA cup semi-final' (we needed to score a goal to have had a shout at that) in such emphatic fashion may have diluted your spin...
  • You can't live on past glories in football unfortunately.

    Worked for Arsenal!
  • rikofold said:


    Personally I was expecting a relegation fight and we've got one.

    "Fight" really? "Fight"? when is that due to start? Unless you define fight as something that (fr)Audley Harrison did as a professional boxer. The current squad under the direction of the current management wouldn't fight its way out of a wet paper bag. Some of them can't, some choose not to and the 'brains of the operation seems to have forgotten how, why, when...

    Beyond parody

    less funny than Michael McIntyre

    taking knives to a gunfight
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  • rikofold said:


    Personally I was expecting a relegation fight and we've got one.

    "Fight" really? "Fight"? when is that due to start? Unless you define fight as something that (fr)Audley Harrison did as a professional boxer. The current squad under the direction of the current management wouldn't fight its way out of a wet paper bag. Some of them can't, some choose not to and the 'brains of the operation seems to have forgotten how, why, when...

    Beyond parody
    Purely out of curiosity, how would you describe how the win against QPR, with a far more talented squad and wage bill 10 times of ours, was achieved ? Or the battling win at a fervent Hillsborough was achieved in the last round ?


    What do you know about things that add up, you work for the Bank of England
  • Well said AKFA perish the thought that the majority of posters on this site have any perspective on things.
  • We got off lightly against QPR, if Ravel Morrison had had his shooting boots on we would have lost, It was just one of those games.
  • We got off lightly against QPR, if Ravel Morrison had had his shooting boots on we would have lost, It was just one of those games.

    And if Callum Harriott had had his shooting boots on, etc etc

  • - You have a mid-table League One club that has finished lower than the previous season for 7 straight years. You have to build a completely new squad and somehow make them gel instantly. You pull it off in emphatic style, winning the title with a record points tally.

    - The following summer the club begins to go into meltdown off the pitch and after buying just one player, a right-sided utility man, all other purchases are called off. You can only add free transfers and loanees to a League One squad. But you nearly take this team to the play-offs in its first season at this level.

    - Yet more uncertainty the next summer. No contracts for key players whose deals are expiring, and indeed your own. With only free transfers and loans available, you are left with just one senior striker 2 days before the new season before two out-of-favour forwards are hastily drafted in to fill the squad.

    - The squad is again competitive despite constant off-field rumours, uncertainty, and unhappiness. Under a new owner, you then have to sell your top scorer and talisman, as well as the core playmaker of your team, currently enjoying his best ever form for the club. You can replace them with foreign loans who know little of English football, and you know little of them.

    - You make some poor tactical decisions, like good managers do every week across the divisions, like one of the club's greatest ever managers did not long ago - often to to the great anger of supporters. But despite having no choice but to rely on two academy players at the very heart of the side, both in their first season of senior football, and having your player of the season for two consecutive seasons almost permanently sidelined, and still going without a notable striker, you stay competitive and nearly reach an FA Cup semi-final.

    And now you should be sacked?

    Best post all season for me, NH.

    Nothing to argue against there, surely ?

  • We got off lightly against QPR, if Ravel Morrison had had his shooting boots on we would have lost, It was just one of those games.

    But he didn't & surely that's one of the multitude of minutiae that wins/loses games ?????

  • the squad is competitive " WTF are you on ? we are bottom and won 6 games scoring 28 goals---------------what is your definition of "competitive" ? its the fact we are NOT competing week in week out that has got us to where we are now. Why we arnt is the issue Lack of quality players----Euro pool/squad bollox-----contract issues----etc or the combination of all three.

  • - You have a mid-table League One club that has finished lower than the previous season for 7 straight years. You have to build a completely new squad and somehow make them gel instantly. You pull it off in emphatic style, winning the title with a record points tally.

    - The following summer the club begins to go into meltdown off the pitch and after buying just one player, a right-sided utility man, all other purchases are called off. You can only add free transfers and loanees to a League One squad. But you nearly take this team to the play-offs in its first season at this level.

    - Yet more uncertainty the next summer. No contracts for key players whose deals are expiring, and indeed your own. With only free transfers and loans available, you are left with just one senior striker 2 days before the new season before two out-of-favour forwards are hastily drafted in to fill the squad.

    - The squad is again competitive despite constant off-field rumours, uncertainty, and unhappiness. Under a new owner, you then have to sell your top scorer and talisman, as well as the core playmaker of your team, currently enjoying his best ever form for the club. You can replace them with foreign loans who know little of English football, and you know little of them.

    - You make some poor tactical decisions, like good managers do every week across the divisions, like one of the club's greatest ever managers did not long ago - often to to the great anger of supporters. But despite having no choice but to rely on two academy players at the very heart of the side, both in their first season of senior football, and having your player of the season for two consecutive seasons almost permanently sidelined, and still going without a notable striker, you stay competitive and nearly reach an FA Cup semi-final.

    And now you should be sacked?

    Great post. 100% accurate.
  • We got off lightly against QPR, if Ravel Morrison had had his shooting boots on we would have lost, It was just one of those games.

    But he didn't & surely that's one of the multitude of minutiae that wins/loses games ?????

    Spot on Fanny and I agree with you but the original question was "Purely out of curiosity, how would you describe how the win against QPR, with a far more talented squad and wage bill 10 times of ours, was achieved"

    I was merely saying I do not think it was achieved through effort, skill or tactical awareness, it was just one of those days and we got a lucky break.
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  • edited March 2014

    You can't live on past glories in football unfortunately. Everything you say is correct, but you have to make the most of what you have. IMO Powell has had a very bad season in this respect. He could have, should have, done some things very differently. From the outset his football has been too negative and one dimensional. We should not have found ourselves flirting with the relegation places with the squad we had in the first half of the season. , yet because of our lowly position, they have snapped up two of our best players. Yann scored only 8 all season with us, yet scores 3 in his first full game for Bournmouth. Our poor style of football has meant that we haven't created nearly enough chances. Harriot has been involved in most of our forward action recently, yet Powell has refused to play him for most of the season. Cousins positive impact on the midfield has been negated by playing him wide. Wilson's good form on the right midfield was negated by pushing him back (should have got in a loan RB). Everything has been geared to not loosing rather than playing good football and trying to score goals. The strategy has been, first contain, then try to nick a goal, then defend it. It's a very negative strategy that has permeated the players and the supporters. It sends out the message that we are not good enough to compete. Our players are far better than that and it's no wonder that their spirits seem to be very low ATM.

    There is so much incorrect here. Where to start ?

    "Our squad was no worse than mid table teams like Bournemouth or Brighton." Sorry, but that is so so wrong. Have a look at their squads & then think again. Even Bourenemouth spent a couple of million on a striker.

    I'm not sure if any of our currently fit players would get in the Brighton team.

    Did Harriot's miss yesterday (which is typical of his form this season) give you any indication, as to why he's not featured much ?

    Yann is scoring at Bournemouth because they have wingers supplying crosses & decent attacking midfielders supplying him.

    Cousins is played wide, because we don't have a decent right sided player apart from Wilson.
    We've tried Green & Pritchard numerous times & they don't cut it. Solly is injured, so if we play Wilson on the right, then we have to play some light weight kid at right back, called Nego, who will likely get spanked.

    I do agree with you on the negative strategy.
  • rikofold said:


    Personally I was expecting a relegation fight and we've got one.

    "Fight" really? "Fight"? when is that due to start? Unless you define fight as something that (fr)Audley Harrison did as a professional boxer. The current squad under the direction of the current management wouldn't fight its way out of a wet paper bag. Some of them can't, some choose not to and the 'brains of the operation seems to have forgotten how, why, when...

    Beyond parody

    less funny than Michael McIntyre

    taking knives to a gunfight
    Take it you're not counting the QPR game then? Or noting that our rivals have played 3 or 4 games more than us but are a win away.

    Might flag you for the McIntyre insult... ;-)
  • I think that you judge football managers on what they are doing now. Not last season.
    On that basis SCP's job is hanging by a thread, unless he gets 2 or three wins on the bounce I can't see any future for him at Charlton.
    I would prefer he stay, but on results he's in the departure lounge.
  • edited March 2014
    I think he was quite brave going so negative against United - had we been more positive there would have been less of a negative reaction, even if we lost. He did it because he thought it was our best chance no doubt, but brave all the same. I hope he is not so brave on Wednesday and next Saturday as that isn't going to get us the points I'm afraid!
  • iainment said:

    I think that you judge football managers on what they are doing now. Not last season.
    On that basis SCP's job is hanging by a thread, unless he gets 2 or three wins on the bounce I can't see any future for him at Charlton.
    I would prefer he stay, but on results he's in the departure lounge.

    If you judged managers exclusively on what the immediate results are and what they are "doing now" then Curbs would've been gone faster than you could say "Clive Mendonca", and Wembley and a decade in the Premier League would probably never have happened.
  • iainment said:

    I think that you judge football managers on what they are doing now. Not last season.
    On that basis SCP's job is hanging by a thread, unless he gets 2 or three wins on the bounce I can't see any future for him at Charlton.
    I would prefer he stay, but on results he's in the departure lounge.

    If you judged managers exclusively on what the immediate results are and what they are "doing now" then Curbs would've been gone faster than you could say "Clive Mendonca", and Wembley and a decade in the Premier League would probably never have happened.
    Things were different then. Would that it were like that now.
  • edited March 2014
    On the point about the squad in comparison to Bournemouth and Brighton, we have a number of players that could form part of a squad higher up in the division. We just don't have the depth in the squad. Pritchard on this seasons form, Gower, Cook, Hollands, Evina, Green etc won't get another contract at this level. They are the sort of players that would have been replaced had we strengthened when we needed to in the last two summers. Church and Sordell are worse than what we previously had in Yann, Fuller and Haynes.

    We don't have any Championship standard wingers. Harriott's not there yet, he's not a regular goalscorer or someone that looks like getting many assists. Stewart was slightly better but not by a great deal, and we didn't manage to keep him. Only Wilson looks a reliable wide midfielder at this level, and he's not an out and out winger, we'd probably still need that type of player elsewhere in the team. Up front we lacked numbers but had Yann, now we have more players but have no target man and none of the players we do have only occasionally provide a threat.

    The midfield was the weakest part of the team in League One and attacking wise at least (Cousins and Poyet have added something but they're not going to regularly score and create goals) it's not been improved at all. Up front BWP scored 20 or so in a lower division, but he struggled with the step up. To push on we've needed better attacking players for a while now but this season it obvious that we desperately need them.

    With no loans looking like coming in it looks like he's going to have to give Nego another go, or try Cousins and Wilson the other way around. Cousins did a job at RM for part of the Sheff Wed game but we can't continue playing him there. People moaned about Pritchard on the right but he looked far more comfortable than Cousins does.

    We also need to fit Adjarevic in somewhere, it might leave us with a weak bench attacking wise but maybe getting that first goal (or even two...) may give us more of a chance to actually win a game. I'd like to see him behind a striker as he did v Sheff Wed. With his size and touch he's the closest we have to a target man or striker with a physical presence. Clearly he won't throw himself about like Yann but he's definitely a creative threat.

    Powell's been trying to fit his best players into the team. Unfortunately that doesn't give us a balanced midfield which really doesn't help us when we're already a team that struggles for goals. With the number of games coming up Powell's going to have to rotate the squad. Hopefully we'll see balanced line ups, even if we are weak in one or two positions, because playing the best players isn't working. We even beat QPR with Danny Green starting on the right of midfield...! He didn't offer much going forwards but he probably had a better game defensively than he usually does, and at least he was comfortable in that position.
  • Cousins was a right back for much of his youth career - so maybe playing him behind Wilson makes more sense than the other way round!
  • iainment said:

    iainment said:

    I think that you judge football managers on what they are doing now. Not last season.
    On that basis SCP's job is hanging by a thread, unless he gets 2 or three wins on the bounce I can't see any future for him at Charlton.
    I would prefer he stay, but on results he's in the departure lounge.

    If you judged managers exclusively on what the immediate results are and what they are "doing now" then Curbs would've been gone faster than you could say "Clive Mendonca", and Wembley and a decade in the Premier League would probably never have happened.
    Things were different then. Would that it were like that now.
    I don't really see why it's any different. The culture is now different i.e. short term emphasis but I think it's wrong in many cases.

    Powell will be a success for us if we give him the time and appropriate opportunity. If I had any cash I would invest in that.
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