So when you like what Prague says it is "logical speculation" but when you don't like what Prague says it is "sensationalist scaremongering".
The reality is that the players whose contracts end in the summer have still to sign new contracts.
I am not aware of anything in Mundell's comment which points to Prague being guilty of "sensationalist scaremongering"! I think this was a generalist term which one can infer applies to a number of posts predicting plague, apocalypse and general visitation by four geezers on horseback!.Why try and put more spin on a situation when various people are trying to get an understanding? It is going to be a much bumpier ride this season and this is probably nothing compared to where things might go?
The reality is that in every season at every club there are players who approach the last year of their contract with a mixture of options and expectations.
From observing the last 12 months we have the benefit of seeing what the board did in terms of signing certain players early, with others being made offers at less generous terms - some accepted and some didn't. And of course some were made no offer at all - I would expect the same thing to happen next summer - anyone challenging that is speculating on the basis of... well actually no factual basis whatsoever!
It is clear that the board are cutting costs and hoping that the Academy will help fill gaps... I will remain consistent and not comment on the squad overall until I have seen a few more games and we see whether the board splashes out on any loan players and by some accounts loan players from the Premier League are not cheap.
Because the owners are looking at a sale, it is dissapointing that they are not considering building on last seasons finish which was the best at the club for six years. As Prague states, the board could be managing comms on this and other areas a lot better...
As GlassHalfFull writes let us hope that investment is found and the club can be steered back onto the upwards trajectory of the last 27 months.
LOL. Accusing me of spin annd then spinning the line you'e been sold hook line and sinker for all its worth.
But then you go on to speculate on what is going to happen in the summer before accusing anyone who dares to challenge you as basing it on nothing at all. So OK for you to speculate but no one else.
Mundell used the term "sensationalist scaremongering" about the rest of the thread on which prague has commented frequently, not me.
It is not clear at all what the board are doing other than desperately hoping they can sell the Club at an inflated price.
And where, as SHG asks, does this leave Powell? Maybe the board will offer him less money when his contract runs out as well.
Let's agree that the board have not explained what they are doing... there is a comms gap which Prague alludes to and one of the aims of the supporters Trust is to find ways to address this - an aim which is repeatedly prioritised by fans in surveys
I haven't been sold "a line" simply analysing what has happened May-July with players renewing or leaving the club - at his reported costs Fuller was never going to stay and the club have clearly cut costs and have NOT strengthened the weakest parts of the squad. It would be great to be a Spurs fan looking at one player going out for €100M with a few others coming in at £20-30M each... but we don't have a single sale let alone a deal like Zaha which would fund what we all see as essential squad development.
As for next summer, not speculation, just a statement of the bleedin' obvious! Some players will stay and some will not be offered... and some will be offered reduced terms... speculation would involve questioning the motivation / rationale and what might happen to fill the gaps with players leaving. Academy? Fresh millions or more of the same?
But for me I think it best to take each game as it comes - as I have said before the irony is that by not improving things now it may become quite expensive to fix later! This club gets relegated and the owners, like Richard Murray before them will struggle to give the club away!
No, it's not a statement of the bleedin obvious because according to Prague's source the board are trying to sign the players up now.
So which is it. Leave it all to the summer or sign them up now?
Or maybe it is FFP as Slater said?
But Slater said the Club wasn't up for sale while at the same time producing a sales brochure full of misleading information.
Letting the contracts of 18 players run down might make sense when you've just had the lowest finish in living memory but why when you've just had you best for 6 years and are tantalisingly close to the Premiership?
Interesting that if this is some sort if negotiation master plan by the club it's one that no other side in the division has adopted. If it was just fringe players that were OOC in eight months time then I could swallow it, but it's not. It's players with serious values and a manager whose stock is still very high.
A nice attempt from Pragues source at putting a good spin on it but the major flaws in the explanation discredit it without further information.
Interesting that if this is some sort if negotiation master plan by the club it's one that no other side in the division has adopted. If it was just fringe players that were OOC in eight months time then I could swallow it, but it's not. It's players with serious values and a manager whose stock is still very high.
A nice attempt from Pragues source at putting a good spin on it but the major flaws in the explanation discredit it without further information.
The small crumb of comfort I can take from it is that somebody somewhere in the club has at last spoken to one of us. I hope that they don't end up suspended regardless of rank for their gesture.
I wonder how much mileage MS and TJ can get out of blaming everything on FFP?
This is an interesting point. I've been sceptical about the rational connection between our current contract situation and FFP. And to be fair, that was not what was suggested to me today. It's a different factor at work. Each year the value of contracts of players in the Prem has been going up and up. But some of these players and their contracts have found their way down a division. They have drained the money out of Championship clubs because their TV money has not gone up at all. It has gone down. So collectively in the Championship the revenue shit has hit the fan. There isn't the money any more to pay high wages. Collapse of both transfer values and player wages - at least where contracts allow.
I don't know whether it's true that Slater is blaming FFP for the contract situation. He doesnt have to. He has plenty enough reason to blame the disgusting, disgraceful way TV money is managed and distributed in English football.
The small crumb of comfort I can take from it is that somebody somewhere in the club has at last spoken to one of us. I hope that they don't end up suspended regardless of rank for their gesture.
I doubt it, I think they've made pretty clear where they are alligned, sadly.
Interesting that if this is some sort if negotiation master plan by the club it's one that no other side in the division has adopted. If it was just fringe players that were OOC in eight months time then I could swallow it, but it's not. It's players with serious values and a manager whose stock is still very high.
A nice attempt from Pragues source at putting a good spin on it but the major flaws in the explanation discredit it without further information.
Well a few days ago I also asked myself if we are alone in doing this. But it was suggested to me today that we are not alone. Blackpool was mentioned, the same Blackpool whom some have claimed are going to grab Yann. I don't think we know, do we, how many other clubs have a similar contract situation. I'd like to know, but it would not be easy to find out.
We have on this thread some of the most knowledgable and valuable people who are fans of Charlton in my view, I have to say the tone does dismay me. I put this down to the deep concern many have about things right now.
I have access to Championship trust people and just emailed them re the market situation they observe at their clubs. We are currently working on a small but significant initiative which will come clear soon.
With regard to us I suggest people all do some digging. This the window and its afternath should hopefully allow verification.
My own view on this is I welcome the communication but reserve judgement.
We are in for a rough ride gents, indeed perhaps we are already, but now is the time to stand together and bring things to the table rather than throwing the cutlery
I don't believe I've previously commented on the fact that most of our players are out of contract at the end of the season. The reason being that it seemed a little pointless, without facts.
However, due to FFP & us along with most Championship clubs, having to slash costs, it's always been my view that the players salaries, will be the major cost cutting area, together with transfer fees.
Transfer fees these days either seem to be in the millions or nothing/not disclosed. The days of the £50K or £100K fee etc seem rare.
Therefore, I believe that we would not receive a fee for the majority of our players, in the current climate.
Even, Solly, Wiggins, Kermorgant, haven't been bid for allegedly.
Therefore, it seems quite logical to me, to let the majority of the contracts run out & either resign them on the same or more likely lower salary, or let them leave.
Let's be honest, our playing squad individually, isn't that strong and it's quite likely we can sign better out of contract players next summer on lower wages.
NB However, we haven't picked up any bargains this summer :-(
Chris Solly and others are not being ignored, but rather in negotiation. but no offer has come in for him so far this year.
Who's source is lying/not fully in the loop !
We will find out in 30 hours, when Saturday's team is announced
Powell has already said that Solly didn't play at Huddersfield due to a couple off "knocks" so his non-appearance on Saturday doesn't mean he's off just as his appearance doesn't mean he still can't be sold before the window closes.
If you exclude clubs who have access to parachute payments (not just the 3 relegated last season, but those on 2nd season income), I think only Notts Forest have splashed the cash
Chris Solly and others are not being ignored, but rather in negotiation. but no offer has come in for him so far this year.
Who's source is lying/not fully in the loop !
We will find out in 30 hours, when Saturday's team is announced
Powell has already said that Solly didn't play at Huddersfield due to a couple off "knocks" so his non-appearance on Saturday doesn't mean he's off just as his appearance doesn't mean he still can't be sold before the window closes.
If, as supaclive claims, there is a deal on the table which Charlton are minded to accept then it will not be jeopardised by him starting on Saturday, will it?
If you exclude clubs who have access to parachute payments (not just the 3 relegated last season, but those on 2nd season income), I think only Notts Forest have splashed the cash
If you exclude clubs who have access to parachute payments (not just the 3 relegated last season, but those on 2nd season income), I think only Notts Forest have splashed the cash
Actually seeing as its a sunny day here, UK parliamentary democracy is alive and well, and Viktoria Plzen are in the Group stages of UCL, I'm feeling lucky.
So. Who wants to bet me that Solly is leaving in this window? Let's be avin' yer!!!!
That's not right mate. Outside the paras, Barnsley, Bournemouth, Derby, Doncaster, Hudds, Ipswich, Leeds, Millwall, Boro, Forest, Yeovil have all spent money / increased their wage bill.
I would say it is only us, Burnley, Brum, Blackpool, Brighton, Leicester, Sheffield W and Watford who have either stood still / regressed in terms of financial commitment. And virtually every one of those would be starting at a much higher level than us.
That's not right mate. Outside the paras, Barnsley, Bournemouth, Derby, Doncaster, Hudds, Ipswich, Leeds, Millwall, Boro, Forest, Yeovil have all spent money / increased their wage bill.
I would say it is only us, Burnley, Brum, Blackpool, Brighton, Leicester, Sheffield W and Watford who have either stood still / regressed in terms of financial commitment. And virtually every one of those would be starting at a much higher level than us.
Not disputing what you say AFKA, but wondering how much hard fact lies behind your assertion. If you have figures, I'd be very interested to get hold of them. Personally I have no idea of any robust, comprehensive source for such an assertion.
Watford is especially tricky because the whole set up is fraudulent in the first place. Who knows where the wages are even paid for all those loaned players from the other two clubs.
So either they don't agree that this wage and fee deflation is true or, as I suspect, there is wage and fee deflation but Charlton just aren't in a position to take advantage of it as TJ and Michael "transferring £1m a month into the Club" Slater don't have any money available.
And the other side of wage and fee deflation is that where as you could sell a Wiggins or a Stephens, even a Solly, to cover some of the losses, deflation and their short remaining contracts means they are not worth that much, if anything, on the market. I also suspect that as with Stephens last summer and the Club as a whole TJ is wildly over pricing any players he is trying to sell or others express an interest in.
And if the idea of one year deals is so good and the way forward why did we give Church and Harriot two years. Surely that goes against the clever "let all their deals run down as we can re-sign them on the cheap next summer" plan.
A different but related thought. Have we actually bought a player since both Varney and Kavanagh left? I don't mean sign but buy. It is relatively easy, so I was let to believe by the people who did it, to loan players or sign unattached players (ie Church and Gower). Actually negotiating a complex deal with staged payments, clauses, add ons etc is a whole different ball game. Maybe Button but that was 1. just after Kavanagh went and 2. turned out rather badly.
The point of concern isn't really that we haven't brought in new players or "splashed the cash" its that we haven't tied good players to new deals. For me there is only logical conclusion to that and it certainly isn't FFP.
@razil - can you ask the Leicester trust guy if pretty much the entirety of their squad and Nigel Pearson are OOC?
Comments
I haven't been sold "a line" simply analysing what has happened May-July with players renewing or leaving the club - at his reported costs Fuller was never going to stay and the club have clearly cut costs and have NOT strengthened the weakest parts of the squad. It would be great to be a Spurs fan looking at one player going out for €100M with a few others coming in at £20-30M each... but we don't have a single sale let alone a deal like Zaha which would fund what we all see as essential squad development.
As for next summer, not speculation, just a statement of the bleedin' obvious! Some players will stay and some will not be offered... and some will be offered reduced terms... speculation would involve questioning the motivation / rationale and what might happen to fill the gaps with players leaving. Academy? Fresh millions or more of the same?
But for me I think it best to take each game as it comes - as I have said before the irony is that by not improving things now it may become quite expensive to fix later! This club gets relegated and the owners, like Richard Murray before them will struggle to give the club away!
So which is it. Leave it all to the summer or sign them up now?
Or maybe it is FFP as Slater said?
But Slater said the Club wasn't up for sale while at the same time producing a sales brochure full of misleading information.
Letting the contracts of 18 players run down might make sense when you've just had the lowest finish in living memory but why when you've just had you best for 6 years and are tantalisingly close to the Premiership?
A nice attempt from Pragues source at putting a good spin on it but the major flaws in the explanation discredit it without further information.
I wonder how much mileage MS and TJ can get out of blaming everything on FFP?
I don't know whether it's true that Slater is blaming FFP for the contract situation. He doesnt have to. He has plenty enough reason to blame the disgusting, disgraceful way TV money is managed and distributed in English football.
I have access to Championship trust people and just emailed them re the market situation they observe at their clubs. We are currently working on a small but significant initiative which will come clear soon.
With regard to us I suggest people all do some digging. This the window and its afternath should hopefully allow verification.
My own view on this is I welcome the communication but reserve judgement.
We are in for a rough ride gents, indeed perhaps we are already, but now is the time to stand together and bring things to the table rather than throwing the cutlery
However, due to FFP & us along with most Championship clubs, having to slash costs, it's always been my view that the players salaries, will be the major cost cutting area, together with transfer fees.
Transfer fees these days either seem to be in the millions or nothing/not disclosed. The days of the £50K or £100K fee etc seem rare.
Therefore, I believe that we would not receive a fee for the majority of our players, in the current climate.
Even, Solly, Wiggins, Kermorgant, haven't been bid for allegedly.
Therefore, it seems quite logical to me, to let the majority of the contracts run out & either resign them on the same or more likely lower salary, or let them leave.
Let's be honest, our playing squad individually, isn't that strong and it's quite likely we can sign better out of contract players next summer on lower wages.
NB However, we haven't picked up any bargains this summer :-(
Who's source is lying/not fully in the loop !
Powell has already said that Solly didn't play at Huddersfield due to a couple off "knocks" so his non-appearance on Saturday doesn't mean he's off just as his appearance doesn't mean he still can't be sold before the window closes.
I would agree
If you exclude clubs who have access to parachute payments (not just the 3
relegated last season, but those on 2nd season income), I think only Notts
Forest have splashed the cash
In: Chris O'Grady (Sheffield Wednesday, £300,000), Dale Jennings (Bayern Munich, £250,000),
Or Huddersfield
In: James Vaughan (Norwich, £1m),
Hmm. Do Huddersfield have a rich backer? They are also supposed to have had a much higher wage bill than us when we both got promoted.
And Barnsley...must have one of the lowest match day revenues in the division...
So. Who wants to bet me that Solly is leaving in this window? Let's be avin' yer!!!!
All wins/payouts go to the Trust !
I would say it is only us, Burnley, Brum, Blackpool, Brighton, Leicester, Sheffield W and Watford who have either stood still / regressed in terms of financial commitment. And virtually every one of those would be starting at a much higher level than us.
Watford is especially tricky because the whole set up is fraudulent in the first place. Who knows where the wages are even paid for all those loaned players from the other two clubs.
Fact is other clubs have been more active than us http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/competitions/championship/10120670/Championship-Summer-Transfers-2013.html
So either they don't agree that this wage and fee deflation is true or, as I suspect, there is wage and fee deflation but Charlton just aren't in a position to take advantage of it as TJ and Michael "transferring £1m a month into the Club" Slater don't have any money available.
And the other side of wage and fee deflation is that where as you could sell a Wiggins or a Stephens, even a Solly, to cover some of the losses, deflation and their short remaining contracts means they are not worth that much, if anything, on the market. I also suspect that as with Stephens last summer and the Club as a whole TJ is wildly over pricing any players he is trying to sell or others express an interest in.
And if the idea of one year deals is so good and the way forward why did we give Church and Harriot two years. Surely that goes against the clever "let all their deals run down as we can re-sign them on the cheap next summer" plan.
A different but related thought. Have we actually bought a player since both Varney and Kavanagh left? I don't mean sign but buy. It is relatively easy, so I was let to believe by the people who did it, to loan players or sign unattached players (ie Church and Gower). Actually negotiating a complex deal with staged payments, clauses, add ons etc is a whole different ball game. Maybe Button but that was 1. just after Kavanagh went and 2. turned out rather badly.
@razil - can you ask the Leicester trust guy if pretty much the entirety of their squad and Nigel Pearson are OOC?