I'm not sure whether I would have got 4 wins out of 6 if I was in charge, but by God Id know that by now you'd be seeing a difference out on the pitch, in terms of performance and personnel !!
I'm sure professioonal footballers would have the upmost respect for you. Who you trying to kid? You KNOW you'd have got 6/6 wins...........
[cite]Posted By: pilchard[/cite]Despite the fact that we have not been Barcelona enough for some in his first 4 games we still won and I very much doubt too many teams in League One play like Barcelona week in week out, so as it is a results driven business we got four favourable results. The last two games have not gone our way but Hartlepool could have been a draw as we hit the post- such is the thin margin between what would have been an acceptable result and what is a disappointing one.
I felt Exeter shaded us on saturday and probably deserved the win but even then we had our chances and hit the post (more than once so we could easily have drawn).
Had we added two draws to the four straight wins we would be seen as one of the form teams. 4 wins 2 defeats -early days for Chrissy Powell- no need for the panic button just yet, things are still gelling, squad being assessed, and quite obviously our manager needs time to get used to the job and the demands made by it too. We do need a little more cohesion against Notts County on friday than we showed collectively against Exeter but hopefully with the right amount of effort and a tweak here and there we can lay our TV hoodoo.
I would add to this that had one or both of the shots that hit the crossbar gone in vs Exeter, we may well have gone on to win the game.
I personally would have preferred the board to have appointed a tried and trusted manager at league 1 level rather than giving Chris Powell his first managerial job. However that said any manager will struggle with our current squad. In my opinion although we have some talented footballers the squad just doesn't gel. There are obvious weaknesses in most area and I just don't think that the current squad is good enough to gain promotion. If I am right Chris Powell's real test will come in the summer. I understand that Semado, Racon & Youga's contracts all expire in the summer and they will probably leave. I am sure that there will be other players also leaving and then Chris will bring in his own players. That is when the real test will start!
[cite]Posted By: Billericay Dickie[/cite]I personally would have preferred the board to have appointed a tried and trusted manager at league 1 level rather than giving Chris Powell his first managerial job.
Been talked about before, but there's not really such thing as a proven (and available) League One manager. Almost everyone proven is already at a higher level. Most others that would be available have a mixed record similar to Parky. At this level most of the managers near the top of the league are fairly young and in their first or second job, it's working this season for clubs and it's worked in the previous seasons.
The way I see it we've taken a gamble that Powell might turn out to be a brilliant manager. The alternative was someone like Gary Johnson who should (but no guarantee of course) be good at this level, but is probably at best a decent Championship manager.
As you say the real test will come in the summer. He could build a completely new squad, and if we don't get promoted this season he'll be expected to take us up next season.
When the board appointed Chris Powell it reminded me very much of when Richard Murray appointed Curbs in 1994. It could turn out to be the work of a genius or a complete disaster.No one knows and only time will tell.
Appointing managers is rather like buying a lottery ticket you cross your fingers and hope for the best. In 1994 when Murray appointed Curbs, he was either inspired or got very lucky. Subsequent appointments of Dowie, Reed, Pardew and Parkinson all proved to be disasters. I just hope that the current board get that "midas" touch once again.
[cite]Posted By: Billericay Dickie[/cite]When the board appointed Chris Powell it reminded me very much of when Richard Murray appointed Curbs in 1994. It could turn out to be the work of a genius or a complete disaster.No one knows and only time will tell.
Appointing managers is rather like buying a lottery ticket you cross your fingers and hope for the best. In 1994 when Murray appointed Curbs, he was either inspired or got very lucky. Subsequent appointments of Dowie, Reed, Pardew and Parkinson all proved to be disasters. I just hope that the current board get that "midas" touch once again.
I really take exception to your comments that Parkinson was a disaster. We finished fourth last season, 3 points from automatic promotion. He left us in fifth position, when it was decided he was no longer good enough for us. If Powell was manager last season and we finished in fourth position and he left us in fifth would you think he was a disaster? Of course you wouldnt because he is a Charlton God and different rules apply.
[cite]Posted By: Billericay Dickie[/cite]When the board appointed Chris Powell it reminded me very much of when Richard Murray appointed Curbs in 1994. It could turn out to be the work of a genius or a complete disaster.No one knows and only time will tell.
Yes. Dowie had a great powerpoint presentation and that has impressed at many interviews, yet he was seen as a disastrous appointment. There are also many examples of so called "experienced managers" failing. The reason for that can be many things as can the reason they were successful at their previous clubs.
The key is that when you are financially more stable, you can afford to take more risks. I agree with dickplumb that Parky wasn't a disaster, indeed in my view he was pretty much the safest choice for a club with no money.
a) he was already on the payroll
b) he took the job originally for no increase in salary/contract
c) he had at least a partially impressive CV
d) he was on the short list when Dowie was chosen
His problem was as I stated earlier, is that he was associated with the Pardew failures and presided over our worst run in history. For that reason he never had the confidence of a majority of fans.
I don't really what to go over old ground regarding Parkinson, but myself and a lot of other Charlton supporters all believe that Parkinson was a total disaster for the club.
In season 2008/9 when he took over the club was outside the relegation bottom 3. In the 25 games that he was in charge for the remainder of that season his record was 3 wins from 25 matches and relegation. In season 2009/10 after a great start I think 8 straight victories bringing 24 points from 24 we struggle and finish 5th. Oh and I forgot we get knocked out of the FA cup by non league opposition.
I agree that it is very unfair to say Parky was a disaster. He was manager at a very difficult time and inherited a criminally unbalanced squad. It could be argued as Pardew's assistant that he had a part to play in this but I think he showed that he was far less reckless and deserves the benefit of the doubt.
I was against giving him the job in the first place and felt we needed an impact manager like Allen or Holloway at the time. But towards the end of the relegation season we were improving. You don't sack a manager when the team is improving - well not from my perspective.
Then Parky had to deal with a shrinking budget and player sales and put a competetive team together that was just short. Bigger cuts and more losses before the start of this season and with a month or so before the start of the season, another relegation was looking a real possibility. Parky did some excellent deals on the cheap and we were competing for promotion. Not a disaster by any means.
Curbs didn't start with instant success - what I admired about him was he knew the strengths and weaknesses of the players/team and what was needed. I think it is fair to say that every season - up to the loss of Scotty Parker - he was able to improve the side. If you do that, you are only going to go in one direction. The peak was him creating a top four side in 2002/2003 but this was scuppered by Chelsea and the rest is history.
Powell has been brought in to have an impact. We can't judge or compare his management with managers who have had time to build teams. This season will be more about his ability to get the best out of what he has got. Coming seasons will tell us if he has the ability to improve the team but I get a good vibe from him and am optimistic.He has the advantage over Parky that whilst he hasn't got millions, he has some relative stability and if you are going to improve a team, you need that. Powell's success this season, will I think depend on his ability for the quick fix- he has said we need a couple of new faces and if he gets the right type we could yet be celebrating come the end of the season. Parky did not leave us with a poor squad for this level, despite what some are saying and there is definitely something that can be built on.
Last season we also happened to be the only top 6 club without a goalscoring striker. Norwich paid something like £400k for Holt, Leeds already had Beckford, Southampton spent £1m (I think) on Lambert. We didn't even have £200k or whatever Millwall spent on Morison to gamble on a non-league striker. Just as Parky's tactics, subs, team selections etc could have been the reason we didn't get 2nd place, not being able to afford a goalscoring striker limited us. He even tried to sign Reid and Jackson the previous summer, but instead they chose other clubs and we went half a season without a left footed left midfielder who could play out wide.
Disaster is unfair when you look at the millions wasted by previous managers and compare how much closer he got to acheiving the expectations of him.
I really can't understand anybody who thinks Parky was a disaster. As has been eloquently outlined above, imho he did a superb job in ever more difficult financial circumstances. Any manager who is prepared to put his hand in his own pocket to fund a loan player's wages in order to give us a better chance of promotion should be celebrated, not reviled.
[cite]Posted By: MuttleyCAFC[/cite]I agree that it is very unfair to say Parky was a disaster. He was manager at a very difficult time and inherited a criminally unbalanced squad. It could be argued as Pardew's assistant that he had a part to play in this but I think he showed that he was far less reckless and deserves the benefit of the doubt.
I was against giving him the job in the first place and felt we needed an impact manager like Allen or Holloway at the time. But towards the end of the relegation season we were improving. You don't sack a manager when the team is improving - well not from my perspective.
Then Parky had to deal with a shrinking budget and player sales and put a competetive team together that was just short. Bigger cuts and more losses before the start of this season and with a month or so before the start of the season, another relegation was looking a real possibility. Parky did some excellent deals on the cheap and we were competing for promotion. Not a disaster by any means.
Curbs didn't start with instant success - what I admired about him was he knew the strengths and weaknesses of the players/team and what was needed. I think it is fair to say that every season - up to the loss of Scotty Parker - he was able to improve the side. If you do that, you are only going to go in one direction. The peak was him creating a top four side in 2002/2003 but this was scuppered by Chelsea and the rest is history.
Powell has been brought in to have an impact. We can't judge or compare his management with managers who have had time to build teams. This season will be more about his ability to get the best out of what he has got. Coming seasons will tell us if he has the ability to improve the team but I get a good vibe from him and am optimistic.He has the advantage over Parky that whilst he hasn't got millions, he has some relative stability and if you are going to improve a team, you need that. Powell's success this season, will I think depend on his ability for the quick fix- he has said we need a couple of new faces and if he gets the right type we could yet be celebrating come the end of the season. Parky did not leave us with a poor squad for this level, despite what some are saying and there is definitely something that can be built on.
'Curbs didn't start with instant success'
In his first season with Gritty with no ground, no squad and no money he got us within 1 place of the play offs (and considering that Derby and Blackburn who did get in had pots of money at the time)
In his first season on his own with a squad full of youngters and virtually no money to spend he got us into the play offs.
Don't forget the season when we lost Gritty - Basically (and I'm not being critical of Curbs here) it took a few years. But it does, if you havent got bags of money. You have to build slowly or be lucky. Curbs was hindered by the sale of Lee but after that he was able to keep his better players together and improve when the opportunity arose until we lost Parker that is. Parky had to deal with the sale of every sellable asset over the last couple of seasons and a diminishing budget and that makes things far more difficult to build.
[cite]Posted By: Red_Pete in Dubai[/cite Any manager who is prepared to put his hand in his own pocket to fund a loan player's wages in order to give us a better chance of promotion should be celebrated, not reviled.
Not sure if the point has been made here already but we do have money to spend which we never had before (in the lower leaques), so I am pretty confident Chris will get us out of this leaque if not this season then next. Not least, I'm happy that there have been changes at the club, with new players coming in right the way down to offers of cheaper tickets. Our ambition as a club is now firmly back on track and it is up to us fans to give the club the support it needs. So, why not be optimistic about the future under the current manager?
[cite]Posted By: Jayajosh[/cite]Not sure if the point has been made here already but we do have money to spend which we never had before (in the lower leaques), so I am pretty confident Chris will get us out of this leaque if not this season then next. Not least, I'm happy that there have been changes at the club, with new players coming in right the way down to offers of cheaper tickets. Our ambition as a club is now firmly back on track and it is up to us fans to give the club the support it needs. So, why not be optimistic about the future under the current manager?
Says who? We spent money on Wright-Phillips but he was a bargain buy from a cash-strapped club. It reminded me a bit of a car dealer who offers you a decent car at a ridiculous price, you couldn't resist and had to find the cash.
That's all speculation and it's not to say that we don't have cash but if we do why didn't we spend? As I said in another thread, the only reason, other than us not being able to get the players we wanted on a permanent, is that we still don't have much cash. That, in turn, depends on how desperate they are to get out of the division this year. Can't see any reason why they wouldn't want to.
You don't need bags of money though - you need to build on the good players you have and not sell them. I think tthe board will be trying to do that rather than looking at how much money they can get for this player or that. At this level there isn't loads of money splashing around anywhere so good players can be picked up for free - the more money you can assign to wages, the better player you can attract. We are in a stronger position under this board than we would have been otherwise and Powell should have a much more solid base to build from than Parky ever had.
[cite]Posted By: Red_Pete in Dubai[/cite Any manager who is prepared to put his hand in his own pocket to fund a loan player's wages in order to give us a better chance of promotion should be celebrated, not reviled.[/cite]
[cite]
don't think that was actually the case.[/cite]
It was the case because i was in the room when Richard Murray said it about Parky re Gary Borrowdale.
Great post MuttleyCAFC.
I came to see Charlton play Exeter saturday, my first game since last season, what the hell has happened???? I saw us last season against Swindon in the playoffs, and the Leeds game at the Valley. I thought Richardson was a class right back, Bailey was a league apart, and Burton looked an experienced frontman, especially at this level. I thought that as long as we kept those three we could go up this season. Where was lloyd Sam? He should also be in the team.
"I'm not sure whether I would have got 4 wins out of 6 if I was in charge, but by God Id know that by now you'd be seeing a difference out on the pitch, in terms of performance and personnel !! "
Hmm, whilst I usually disagree with most of your opinions Golfy, this one really is a cracker. I'd think you were delusional if I didn't know better. Did you apply btw ?
Comments
I'm sure professioonal footballers would have the upmost respect for you. Who you trying to kid? You KNOW you'd have got 6/6 wins...........
I would add to this that had one or both of the shots that hit the crossbar gone in vs Exeter, we may well have gone on to win the game.
Wish I'd said this.
You will Gilbert, you will : - )
The way I see it we've taken a gamble that Powell might turn out to be a brilliant manager. The alternative was someone like Gary Johnson who should (but no guarantee of course) be good at this level, but is probably at best a decent Championship manager.
As you say the real test will come in the summer. He could build a completely new squad, and if we don't get promoted this season he'll be expected to take us up next season.
Appointing managers is rather like buying a lottery ticket you cross your fingers and hope for the best. In 1994 when Murray appointed Curbs, he was either inspired or got very lucky. Subsequent appointments of Dowie, Reed, Pardew and Parkinson all proved to be disasters. I just hope that the current board get that "midas" touch once again.
I really take exception to your comments that Parkinson was a disaster. We finished fourth last season, 3 points from automatic promotion. He left us in fifth position, when it was decided he was no longer good enough for us. If Powell was manager last season and we finished in fourth position and he left us in fifth would you think he was a disaster? Of course you wouldnt because he is a Charlton God and different rules apply.
Yes. Dowie had a great powerpoint presentation and that has impressed at many interviews, yet he was seen as a disastrous appointment. There are also many examples of so called "experienced managers" failing. The reason for that can be many things as can the reason they were successful at their previous clubs.
The key is that when you are financially more stable, you can afford to take more risks. I agree with dickplumb that Parky wasn't a disaster, indeed in my view he was pretty much the safest choice for a club with no money.
a) he was already on the payroll
b) he took the job originally for no increase in salary/contract
c) he had at least a partially impressive CV
d) he was on the short list when Dowie was chosen
His problem was as I stated earlier, is that he was associated with the Pardew failures and presided over our worst run in history. For that reason he never had the confidence of a majority of fans.
In season 2008/9 when he took over the club was outside the relegation bottom 3. In the 25 games that he was in charge for the remainder of that season his record was 3 wins from 25 matches and relegation.
In season 2009/10 after a great start I think 8 straight victories bringing 24 points from 24 we struggle and finish 5th. Oh and I forgot we get knocked out of the FA cup by non league opposition.
Disaster no question!
I was against giving him the job in the first place and felt we needed an impact manager like Allen or Holloway at the time. But towards the end of the relegation season we were improving. You don't sack a manager when the team is improving - well not from my perspective.
Then Parky had to deal with a shrinking budget and player sales and put a competetive team together that was just short. Bigger cuts and more losses before the start of this season and with a month or so before the start of the season, another relegation was looking a real possibility. Parky did some excellent deals on the cheap and we were competing for promotion. Not a disaster by any means.
Curbs didn't start with instant success - what I admired about him was he knew the strengths and weaknesses of the players/team and what was needed. I think it is fair to say that every season - up to the loss of Scotty Parker - he was able to improve the side. If you do that, you are only going to go in one direction. The peak was him creating a top four side in 2002/2003 but this was scuppered by Chelsea and the rest is history.
Powell has been brought in to have an impact. We can't judge or compare his management with managers who have had time to build teams. This season will be more about his ability to get the best out of what he has got. Coming seasons will tell us if he has the ability to improve the team but I get a good vibe from him and am optimistic.He has the advantage over Parky that whilst he hasn't got millions, he has some relative stability and if you are going to improve a team, you need that. Powell's success this season, will I think depend on his ability for the quick fix- he has said we need a couple of new faces and if he gets the right type we could yet be celebrating come the end of the season. Parky did not leave us with a poor squad for this level, despite what some are saying and there is definitely something that can be built on.
Last season we also happened to be the only top 6 club without a goalscoring striker. Norwich paid something like £400k for Holt, Leeds already had Beckford, Southampton spent £1m (I think) on Lambert. We didn't even have £200k or whatever Millwall spent on Morison to gamble on a non-league striker. Just as Parky's tactics, subs, team selections etc could have been the reason we didn't get 2nd place, not being able to afford a goalscoring striker limited us. He even tried to sign Reid and Jackson the previous summer, but instead they chose other clubs and we went half a season without a left footed left midfielder who could play out wide.
Disaster is unfair when you look at the millions wasted by previous managers and compare how much closer he got to acheiving the expectations of him.
'Curbs didn't start with instant success'
In his first season with Gritty with no ground, no squad and no money he got us within 1 place of the play offs (and considering that Derby and Blackburn who did get in had pots of money at the time)
In his first season on his own with a squad full of youngters and virtually no money to spend he got us into the play offs.
But not an instant success!
don't think that was actually the case.
Says who? We spent money on Wright-Phillips but he was a bargain buy from a cash-strapped club. It reminded me a bit of a car dealer who offers you a decent car at a ridiculous price, you couldn't resist and had to find the cash.
That's all speculation and it's not to say that we don't have cash but if we do why didn't we spend? As I said in another thread, the only reason, other than us not being able to get the players we wanted on a permanent, is that we still don't have much cash. That, in turn, depends on how desperate they are to get out of the division this year. Can't see any reason why they wouldn't want to.
It was the case because i was in the room when Richard Murray said it about Parky re Gary Borrowdale.
Great post MuttleyCAFC.
I thought Richardson was a class right back, Bailey was a league apart, and Burton looked an experienced frontman, especially at this level. I thought that as long as we kept those three we could go up this season. Where was lloyd Sam? He should also be in the team.
OMLY KIDDING..........
"I'm not sure whether I would have got 4 wins out of 6 if I was in charge, but by God Id know that by now you'd be seeing a difference out on the pitch, in terms of performance and personnel !! "
Hmm, whilst I usually disagree with most of your opinions Golfy, this one really is a cracker. I'd think you were delusional if I didn't know better. Did you apply btw ?