[cite]Posted By: harveys gardener[/cite]Lots of people on this site can't understand why he didn't rain in crosses to our lone 5'9" striker.
It's a good point which was often ignored. Even when we played 2 up front the best player in the air was Akpo, and he isn't/wasn't great at winning headers.
For whatever reason he had huge expectations. Probably because he was a part (just about) of our Premier League team. While he might have more skill and a better cross than Wagstaff, he's not as quick, fit or as good a finisher. Yet there was disappointment that he couldn't assist like he did and also score like Waggy and Reid.
He's also not as quick compared to other wingers, Reid and Wagstaff here at least two, but was expected to sprint past defenders like he had Rommedahl's pace.
Reid is not only quicker than Sam but stronger, no surprise he'll try and take players on more often and is more direct with it.
Like Stu and Oggy said, we haven't replaced the qualities he did have. Not a Prem standard player but useful at Champonship level.
Playing regularly, 90 minutes, not trudging off every game with his head down on the floor trying to get sympathy etc etc etc.
I never liked to hear him slagged off and would stand his corner. However, when he pulled out of that tackle he was no longer a Charlton player for me.
NLA I can't believe how many people showed depraved dogma against him. I understand most of the criticisms against him, BUT (sorry it's a big but) compared to every wide left or right player we've had since Reid he was the only one who was a factor in matches. When you then compare how important and reliable he became in protecting his fb, to Ambrose, Thomas and even Bailey, he had to be in the team week in week out.
assists are opinions. goals are FACT.
according to soccerbase lloyd sam scored 7 goals in 107 starts for us.
wagstaff has scored the same amount in 20.
[cite]Posted By: ColinTat[/cite]NLA I can't believe how many people were dogmatically depraved against him. I understand most of the criticisms against him, BUT (sorry it's a big but) compared to every wide left or right player we've had since Reid he was the only one who was a factor in matches. When you then compare how important and reliable he became in protecting his fb, to Ambrose, Thomas and even Bailey, he had to be in the team week in week out.
[cite]Posted By: paulbaconsarnie[/cite]assists are opinions. goals are FACT.
according to soccerbase lloyd sam scored 7 goals in 107 starts for us.
wagstaff has scored the same amount in 20.
Elliot is crap, when was the last time he scored a goal
Then his engine started being so empty inside 25 mins.
He started to constantly cut inside sometimes doing so twice in the same move
Tell me one thing
Is it easier to defend a ball when the player is running face on towards you or is it easier to defend a ball when you are facing your own goal and the ball has been fizzed in from the side.
For a player who refused to go wide for whatever reason and ping a ball in and contstantly cut inside and tried to shoot or trick the defender you would expect to see more than 7 goals in 107 starts
In the Chumpionship i thought go on then show me what you have son (he failed)
In league 1 he failed even more miserably this player so many seem to think was the real key to our side last year let you down he never mesmerised defences with his tricks and he ran out of steam before the 1st half was over.
So either our training was cack and his fitness was Parkies fault or Lloyd Sam was not as good a player that many seem to think.
Did he really offer support to our FB in a defensive way i spose yes you could say that but i want my Wingers to do more going forward not to only be rememberd for covering his FB
Nothing annoyed me more at the game than watching this player who so obviuosly has a talent for football failing to produce it week in week out season in season out
[cite]Posted By: nth london addick[/cite]In league 1 he failed even more miserably this player so many seem to think was the real key to our side last year let you down he never mesmerised defences with his tricks and he ran out of steam before the 1st half was over.
How many others provided as many goals/assists as sam did last season?
How many of the current team do you think will get similar stats this season?
[cite]Posted By: nth london addick[/cite]Lloyd had bag loads of talent that was obvious.
Does he though? He's not got a good shot, doesn't always make the runs into space that he should and isn't the most composed player in front of goal.
Those are talents just as much as a few tricks, a good cross and touch are.
I don't even rate him that highly. Just think he was an important but admittedly consistent player last season. Can play in the Championship but some way off being one of the best wingers in the league.
don't panic.
everyone that keeps commenting on lloydies assists, it appears that simon francis managed only 1 less last year from full back in a struggling side.
Cannot understand the debate. He was awful. The player we should be ashamed to let go is Ambrose -
and Reid, and Parker, and Konchesky, and Bowyer, and Defoe, and Cole, and Di Canio, and Bent, and Young, and Lee, and................
You see, the imagination runs wild. Had to sit there last season and watch this useless sod in pink boots run round in circles. I had a sheepdog that used to do it many years ago. Eventually we had him put down. We asked him if he wanted to go to Leeds, he chose to be put down !!!
[cite]Posted By: paulbaconsarnie[/cite]assists are opinions. goals are FACT.
according to soccerbase lloyd sam scored 7 goals in 107 starts for us.
wagstaff has scored the same amount in 20.
Elliot is crap, when was the last time he scored a goal
agreed but he gets lots of assists for the opposition
[cite aria-level=0 aria-posinset=0 aria-setsize=0]Posted By: nth london addick[/cite]In league 1 he failed even more miserably this player so many seem to think was the real key to our side last year let you down he never mesmerised defences with his tricks and he ran out of steam before the 1st half was over.
How many others provided as many goals/assists as sam did last season?
How many of the current team do you think will get similar stats this season?
not as many as sam but he was played over others so hard to compare
reid and martin have 1 each as dooes waggy and we are only 5 games in so who knows
i certainly dont see sam as a key miss this season
[cite aria-level=0 aria-posinset=0 aria-setsize=0]Posted By: nth london addick[/cite]Lloyd had bag loads of talent that was obvious.
Does he though? He's not got a good shot, doesn't always make the runs into space that he should and isn't the most composed player in front of goal.
Those are talents just as much as a few tricks, a good cross and touch are.
I don't even rate him that highly. Just think he was an important but admittedly consistent player last season. Can play in the Championship but some way off being one of the best wingers in the league.
[cite]Posted By: nth london addick[/cite]i certainly dont see sam as a key miss this season
Not a key miss, I agree, but no team in the league could double mark both Reid and Sam! That was Sams
biggest problem last year and I can see it happening to Reid this year
[cite aria-level=0 aria-posinset=0 aria-setsize=0]Posted By: nth london addick[/cite]i certainly dont see sam as a key miss this season
Not a key miss, I agree, but no team in the league could double mark both Reid and Sam! That was Sams
biggest problem last year and I can see it happening to Reid this year
but with waggy scoring 2 already they would be foolish to have not done homework on him and think he was no threat and martin offers as much as sam if not more
[cite]Posted By: nth london addick[/cite]brentford at home showed what he could do
That's a bit like saying Lisbie's game against Liverpool shows what he can do.
It was just one game. Watching Sam play and his goal record show he's not a good finisher. It's one of the bigger weaknesses in his game.
No one expected our other main players to control games or destroy opponents every week. Reid doesn't but he's a fans favourite. Bailey didn't control the midfield every game. Why was Sam expected to find this division easy more than other players are/were? Is he more talented than any other player we've had in the last few years?
Ambrose? You are having a laugh. Sam made nine assists in the worst ever side I've ever seen at Charlton. Ambrose did none; and one after Reidy left. Ambrose will not improve past a champ team, and he'll only perform in a team that fights for him. Now Sam is in a team that physically competes and battles, suddenly he get's more effective????? Sam did it in shit, Ambrose never will.
I don't normally laugh at other people opinions as you are fully entitled,. All I can say is you must be like Sam lloyd as far as rose coloured bla bla bla bla bla..... puh pat phah phah pha........ Ambrose has proved beyond doubt that he is a better player than Sam. He didn't perform well at Charlton, but he has proven elsewhere he is a better player.
Sam DIDN'T do it in shit --- listen - HE DIDN'T DO IT. !!!!!!!!!!!
[cite]Posted By: masicat[/cite]I don't normally laugh at other people opinions as you are fully entitled,. All I can say is you must be like Sam lloyd as far as rose coloured bla bla bla bla bla.....
puh pat phah phah pha........
Ambrose has proved beyond doubt that he is a better player than Sam. He didn't perform well at Charlton, but he has proven elsewhere he is a better player.
Sam DIDN'T do it in shit --- listen - HE DIDN'T DO IT. !!!!!!!!!!!
So shouting your opinions is supposed to convince people your myopic view is correct?
masicat are you a cartoon rabbi? No can't be as even a caricature rabbi paints a thought with his peculiar back to front syntax.
Ambrose has proved nothing. If he get's back into a Warnock team he'll again be effective, unfortunately for him he's stuck with George Burley in a declining team. So we'll soon see your 'beyond doubt' of him proving himself. So proving himself is one season with Burley, and one with Warnock? As the player you so quaintly called Sam Lloyd, will be effective for Leeds it'll be an interesting comparison this season. Mr Sam has weaknesses in his game, but plays for the team something Ambrose is never able to do as he needs people like Sam defending and creating whilst he lolls about in no mans land.
Comments
can't be fact, if it is fact then fact needs to be written in capitals, its one of the earliest CL laws I learnt. No capitals, no fact.
For whatever reason he had huge expectations. Probably because he was a part (just about) of our Premier League team. While he might have more skill and a better cross than Wagstaff, he's not as quick, fit or as good a finisher. Yet there was disappointment that he couldn't assist like he did and also score like Waggy and Reid.
He's also not as quick compared to other wingers, Reid and Wagstaff here at least two, but was expected to sprint past defenders like he had Rommedahl's pace.
Reid is not only quicker than Sam but stronger, no surprise he'll try and take players on more often and is more direct with it.
Like Stu and Oggy said, we haven't replaced the qualities he did have. Not a Prem standard player but useful at Champonship level.
FACT- I HAVE MADE A PLEDGE
??????????????????
I never liked to hear him slagged off and would stand his corner. However, when he pulled out of that tackle he was no longer a Charlton player for me.
according to soccerbase lloyd sam scored 7 goals in 107 starts for us.
wagstaff has scored the same amount in 20.
You forgot Rommedahl
Elliot is crap, when was the last time he scored a goal
only the asking if 118 apps and 6 goals was correct on wiki.
Then his engine started being so empty inside 25 mins.
He started to constantly cut inside sometimes doing so twice in the same move
Tell me one thing
Is it easier to defend a ball when the player is running face on towards you or is it easier to defend a ball when you are facing your own goal and the ball has been fizzed in from the side.
For a player who refused to go wide for whatever reason and ping a ball in and contstantly cut inside and tried to shoot or trick the defender you would expect to see more than 7 goals in 107 starts
In the Chumpionship i thought go on then show me what you have son (he failed)
In league 1 he failed even more miserably this player so many seem to think was the real key to our side last year let you down he never mesmerised defences with his tricks and he ran out of steam before the 1st half was over.
So either our training was cack and his fitness was Parkies fault or Lloyd Sam was not as good a player that many seem to think.
Did he really offer support to our FB in a defensive way i spose yes you could say that but i want my Wingers to do more going forward not to only be rememberd for covering his FB
Nothing annoyed me more at the game than watching this player who so obviuosly has a talent for football failing to produce it week in week out season in season out
When Sam was good he was very very good
when he was bad he was woeful
when he was poor he was missing
How many others provided as many goals/assists as sam did last season?
How many of the current team do you think will get similar stats this season?
Those are talents just as much as a few tricks, a good cross and touch are.
I don't even rate him that highly. Just think he was an important but admittedly consistent player last season. Can play in the Championship but some way off being one of the best wingers in the league.
everyone that keeps commenting on lloydies assists, it appears that simon francis managed only 1 less last year from full back in a struggling side.
and Reid, and Parker, and Konchesky, and Bowyer, and Defoe, and Cole, and Di Canio, and Bent, and Young, and Lee, and................
You see, the imagination runs wild. Had to sit there last season and watch this useless sod in pink boots run round in circles. I had a sheepdog that used to do it many years ago. Eventually we had him put down. We asked him if he wanted to go to Leeds, he chose to be put down !!!
agreed but he gets lots of assists for the opposition
not as many as sam but he was played over others so hard to compare
reid and martin have 1 each as dooes waggy and we are only 5 games in so who knows
i certainly dont see sam as a key miss this season
brentford at home showed what he could do
Not a key miss, I agree, but no team in the league could double mark both Reid and Sam! That was Sams
biggest problem last year and I can see it happening to Reid this year
but with waggy scoring 2 already they would be foolish to have not done homework on him and think he was no threat and martin offers as much as sam if not more
It was just one game. Watching Sam play and his goal record show he's not a good finisher. It's one of the bigger weaknesses in his game.
No one expected our other main players to control games or destroy opponents every week. Reid doesn't but he's a fans favourite. Bailey didn't control the midfield every game. Why was Sam expected to find this division easy more than other players are/were? Is he more talented than any other player we've had in the last few years?
Ambrose? You are having a laugh. Sam made nine assists in the worst ever side I've ever seen at Charlton. Ambrose did none; and one after Reidy left. Ambrose will not improve past a champ team, and he'll only perform in a team that fights for him. Now Sam is in a team that physically competes and battles, suddenly he get's more effective????? Sam did it in shit, Ambrose never will.
puh pat phah phah pha........
Ambrose has proved beyond doubt that he is a better player than Sam. He didn't perform well at Charlton, but he has proven elsewhere he is a better player.
Sam DIDN'T do it in shit --- listen - HE DIDN'T DO IT. !!!!!!!!!!!
Anywhere they're on a similar level aren't they, Championship at best.
So shouting your opinions is supposed to convince people your myopic view is correct?
Some ego trip you're having, mate.
Ambrose has proved nothing. If he get's back into a Warnock team he'll again be effective, unfortunately for him he's stuck with George Burley in a declining team. So we'll soon see your 'beyond doubt' of him proving himself. So proving himself is one season with Burley, and one with Warnock? As the player you so quaintly called Sam Lloyd, will be effective for Leeds it'll be an interesting comparison this season. Mr Sam has weaknesses in his game, but plays for the team something Ambrose is never able to do as he needs people like Sam defending and creating whilst he lolls about in no mans land.