[cite]Posted By: guinnessaddick[/cite]Had a couple of millwall in front of me in the north upper. Before the game started they were on thier mobiles and waving to someone in the east stand. When millwall scored one of them was downstairs and the other one put his arm in the air and when "Yes". I tapped him on his back and told him to F**K off. Took me a couple times to tell where to go and him it was for his own safety. With that his mate came to the top of the stairs and I told him to f**k off as well. The steward then got involved and both of them left. After a couple of minutes, I went out to the toilet, the two blokes were talking to the steward, when I came back out they had gone. I asked the steward what had happened to them, he told me that they had gone to sit in an other part of the upper north.
What a joke.
How stupid. They really could Steward a football match if they got paid to o wait they do joke
After all their emphasis on this match - ticket restrictions etc., the club completely fcked this one up didnt they? Stewards looked clueless, police nowhere to be seen in the ground to back them up. The stewards have always been this bad to be fair, i remember when we sent palace down - people apparently had to throw nigels out themselves instead of asking the stewards to do it.But i was suprised the police werent more involved in the ground. Seems that most millwall's plan of just showing up ad getting in worked from the look of the JS.They took the piss yesterday, and got away with it.
Like i said to oneof the SS types you soon steaming up and dragging some kid out for having a fag or having a sneaky can of beer , now this lot are around you doing F**k all.
There was a couple in NW quadrant and after some of our boys where making there way down to teach em the stewards thought they should chuck them out but only after us in NW where getting loud and frustrated so i do agree that the steward where poor..
[cite]Posted By: Se12Addick[/cite]After all their emphasis on this match - ticket restrictions etc., the club completely fcked this one up didnt they? Stewards looked clueless, police nowhere to be seen in the ground to back them up. The stewards have always been this bad to be fair, i remember when we sent palace down - people apparently had to throw nigels out themselves instead of asking the stewards to do it.But i was suprised the police werent more involved in the ground. Seems that most millwall's plan of just showing up ad getting in worked from the look of the JS.They took the piss yesterday, and got away with it.
Took the piss? Bolox they did. They have been spoutng for ages that there would be a 'tsunami' of Spanners taking over the Valley ... well, they didn't.
Sure there were pockets of them around, that's unavoidable.
But we had more in the home ends of Gillingham than Spanners did at the Valley yesterday.
whatever they get paid is not the point they are employed to steward the match and deal with things and they did not.
They knew the wage when they applied they knew what the job was about so they should do there job
Very poor
Actually half of them are forced to take this kind of job or they get no money at all.yes they knew the wage but that dont mean they want to get a smack in the mouth just cos they're earning £7 an hour.Its either get a job or lose your benefits,this is the only kind of work some of them can do
[cite]Posted By: Se12Addick[/cite]After all their emphasis on this match - ticket restrictions etc., the club completely fcked this one up didnt they? Stewards looked clueless, police nowhere to be seen in the ground to back them up. The stewards have always been this bad to be fair, i remember when we sent palace down - people apparently had to throw nigels out themselves instead of asking the stewards to do it.But i was suprised the police werent more involved in the ground. Seems that most millwall's plan of just showing up ad getting in worked from the look of the JS.They took the piss yesterday, and got away with it.
Took the piss? Bolox they did. They have been spoutng for ages that there would be a 'tsunami' of Spanners taking over the Valley ... well, they didn't.
Sure there were pockets of them around, that's unavoidable.
But we had more in the home ends of Gillingham than Spanners did at the Valley yesterday.
and i reckon we'll have more in the home end at theres aswel, although our pockets of fans wont be dickheads, its been 13 yrs since we played them for christ sake, they are our closest local rivals, there will always be opposing fans in home ends and alike
[quote][cite]Posted By: Merty111[/cite]There was a couple in NW quadrant and after some of our boys where making there way down to teach em the stewards thought they should chuck them out but only after us in NW where getting loud and frustrated so i do agree that the steward where poor..[/quote]
whatever they get paid is not the point they are employed to steward the match and deal with things and they did not. They knew the wage when they applied they knew what the job was about so they should do there job Very poor[/quote]
Actually half of them are forced to take this kind of job or they get no money at all.yes they knew the wage but that dont mean they want to get a smack in the mouth just cos they're earning £7 an hour.Its either get a job or lose your benefits,this is the only kind of work some of them can do[/quote]
Ok still be gratful you have a job and do you job end of, 2.5 million out there who would be pleased to have the money and do they job, i know that my work ethic and trust me i have had some badly paid jobs and poor working condtions , BUT i still go to work and do what im emplyeed to do
Police should have been in the ground thats is true and why wasn't they a question i asked one of the SS type stewards, he said we will only call them if we need them and we dont need them, so they must of thought they were capable and willing. Im only disagreeing with the money side of things not the arrangements, as O/B were wrong to stay behind they scenes they dont any other game
Im not bothered about what they said they'd do - when it became clear there were 15-20 of them in the East and they were gonna celebrate like that - they should have been chucked out straight away.
[cite]Posted By: leftbehind[/cite]Police should have been in the ground thats is true and why wasn't they a question i asked one of the SS type stewards, he said we will only call them if we need them and we dont need them, so they must of thought they were capable and willing. Im only disagreeing with the money side of things not the arrangements, as O/B were wrong to stay behind they scenes they dont any other game
I'm not directly involved in any of this, but I may have a more informed view from the club's perspective, having been party to the ticketing arrangements and talked yesterday to those whose job it was to manage the event.
How many and when police are in the ground is not a decision for the stewards or the club, it is decided by the police themselves through their senior officer in the control room.
A lot of judgements are being made here on the basis of perception and what individuals witnessed. What most people didn't see was the two mobs of ticketless Millwall removed from the local area after kick-off - estimated at about 250 - few of whom would have merged into the background if they had succeeded in forcing their way in. The fact they didn't have tickets says something of itself about the success of the ticketing precautions.
We do know the some of those who showed out in the east did not have tickets and did not get in through the entrances or exits. The geography of The Valley has made this an issue throughout its history, but it was a small number. I wasn't aware of any Millwall fans around me at all, in contrast to previous games against Arsenal, Chelsea, etc.
We always knew that some Millwall fans would obtain tickets through eligible Charlton fans - not all season-ticket holders - and that some Charlton fans would sell tickets on. I would say that we prevented them gathering in significant numbers in any home area.
That left us to manage those who chose to make themselves known. The majority of stewards are not employed to deal with this issue. They are there to staff the exits and keep gangways clear in accordance with the safety certificate. So you will always get stewards who hold off dealing with any situation while they wait for support. It's also not part of their job to exact retribution, however much it would satisfy some home fans.
I don't agree with the perception that the JS Stand was over capacity. There were empty seats in the bottom left corner of the stand in the first half. But that's just my perception viewed from the east stand and it's no more or less valid than the perception of others in different parts of the ground. The reality is that the security operation around the away end and the CCTV footage of any overcrowding would tell the story.
Finally, people want to know if the club will follow up its promise to deal with any Charlton supporters who provided tickets to away fans and some are already criticising the club on the basis that it won't. Perhaps that judgement should be deferred?
[cite]Posted By: Airman Brown[/cite]We do know the some of those who showed out in the east did not have tickets and did not get in through the entrances or exits. The geography of The Valley has made this an issue throughout its history, but it was a small number.
How did they manage that? I'm guessing by climbing over a wall over in the South East corner or something? Also, how did a group of them manage to force there way through a gate in the West Stand and get away with it?
[cite]Posted By: Merty111[/cite]There was a couple in NW quadrant and after some of our boys where making there way down to teach em the stewards thought they should chuck them out but only after us in NW where getting loud and frustrated so i do agree that the steward where poor..
That was me :-)
[cite]Posted By: uncle[/cite]
[cite]Posted By: leftbehind[/cite]Uncle
whatever they get paid is not the point they are employed to steward the match and deal with things and they did not.
They knew the wage when they applied they knew what the job was about so they should do there job
Very poor
Actually half of them are forced to take this kind of job or they get no money at all.yes they knew the wage but that dont mean they want to get a smack in the mouth just cos they're earning £7 an hour.Its either get a job or lose your benefits,this is the only kind of work some of them can do
Ok still be gratful you have a job and do you job end of, 2.5 million out there who would be pleased to have the money and do they job, i know that my work ethic and trust me i have had some badly paid jobs and poor working condtions , BUT i still go to work and do what im emplyeed to do
I think you are expecting to much from people who just want a job not get a kick in. Its like expecting a securicor driver when being held up to defend the money he is carrying even if there is a threat of being shot. Just because he gets paid £7 an hour to do so. After all he knows what the job is when he takes it on. Me i would hand the money over but you would obviously rather get shot at least you'd be doing what your paid to do
I think you are expecting to much from people who just want a job not get a kick in. Its like expecting a securicor driver when being held up to defend the money he is carrying even if there is a threat of being shot. Just because he gets paid £7 an hour to do so. After all he knows what the job is when he takes it on. Me i would hand the money over but you would obviously rather get shot at least you'd be doing what your paid to do
Spot on Uncle, these people are basically employed to show people to their seats and keep an eye on people, if we want every steward to be a bouncer our stewarding bill would be ten times higher.
I think you are expecting to much from people who just want a job not get a kick in. Its like expecting a securicor driver when being held up to defend the money he is carrying even if there is a threat of being shot. Just because he gets paid £7 an hour to do so. After all he knows what the job is when he takes it on. Me i would hand the money over but you would obviously rather get shot at least you'd be doing what your paid to do
Spot on Uncle, these people are basically employed to show people to their seats and keep an eye on people, if we want every steward to be a bouncer our stewarding bill would be ten times higher.
That's correct, but where were the stewards who are meant to deal with them? The bullies ones who wear the orange jackets, apparently work at Belmarsh during the week and throw kids out for standing on their seats? The basic stewards shouldn't have had to deal with it, they're not trained to do so and they shouldn't have to take the risk.
[cite]Posted By: Airman Brown[/cite] What most people didn't see was the two mobs of ticketless Millwall removed from the local area after kick-off - estimated at about 250 - few of whom would have merged into the background if they had succeeded in forcing their way in. The fact they didn't have tickets says something of itself about the success of the ticketing precautions.
yep i saw one of those neanderthal groups ...... i mean they were there for one thing only and it wasn't to watch the footy and if the police/club/stewards hadn't done their job and gotten rid of that scum i genuinely dread to think of what might have happened..... to those who thought it was all over hyped on another day it could have been so so much worse , so well done to the security operation that took place.
I think you are expecting to much from people who just want a job not get a kick in. Its like expecting a securicor driver when being held up to defend the money he is carrying even if there is a threat of being shot. Just because he gets paid £7 an hour to do so. After all he knows what the job is when he takes it on. Me i would hand the money over but you would obviously rather get shot at least you'd be doing what your paid to do
Spot on Uncle, these people are basically employed to show people to their seats and keep an eye on people, if we want every steward to be a bouncer our stewarding bill would be ten times higher.
That's correct, but where were the stewards who are meant to deal with them? The[strike]bullies[/strike]ones who wear the orange jackets, apparently work at Belmarsh during the week and throw kids out for standing on their seats? The basic stewards shouldn't have had to deal with it, they're not trained to do so and they shouldn't have to take the risk.
Most of them were probably sitting in the Jimmy Seed with their mates fella.
I thought the crowd throughout were polite and appeciative, many smiling and shaking each others hands. They cheered and clapped when it was warranted and stayed quiet when it wasn't. This applied to both adults and children. The players gave their all and were loudly cheered off at the interval when the audience filed out for light refreshments. At the end the whole crowd stood up and clapped the players off and many called out for an encore. Finally we all made our way out in an orderly fashion into the cold London streets. I saw no fighting or people yelling abuse at each other. A great afternoon's entertainment was had by all. Oh,......................perhaps I should have mentioned I was at the National's wonderful production of War Horse at the Drury Lane Theatre, sorry.
Airman Brown. I would like you to address a particular point. The two Millwall supporters in the NW Quadrant. They stood up and celebrated the first goal. They were highlighted to a steward. Several Charlton supporters made some half-hearted attempts at dealing with them. It was fully ten minutes before the Snatch Squad showed up and eventually removed them. How would this situation have looked if any Charlton supporters had taken them on and a brawl had occured? As other posters have said. They're pretty quick off the mark if someone has a sneaky fag or smuggles a capped bottle into the ground.
There did seem to be a lot more than capacity in the away end. The gangway between upper and lower tiers was full but the bottom East and West corners were empty.
The idiots in the East Stand should have been arrested and then received banning orders - in light of the punishment a few of ours received for arm waving at Norwich, it is laughable that the scum in the East got allowed into the away end. If they didn't have tickets for the Jimmy Seed then it must breach many rules to have put them in there.
The couple of idiots in the NW were hardly a problem and with all the people counted we're looking at about 30 in a home crowd of 16,000 - hardly the invasion they were claiming so well done to the club on that - still believe the prats in the East should have been nicked though.
Seemed to be something going on outside the Con as I arrived at 245 and the police were full on Special Forces types so if they did genuinely remove 250 from the area then well done to them. The belmarsh stewards were definately in the North Upper as I asked to be directed to my seat and they said we're not here for that and smiled - shame they weren't stationed over in the East as they would have handled that situation with aplomb.
[cite]Posted By: PL54[/cite]in light of the punishment a few of ours received for arm waving at Norwich, it is laughable that the scum in the East got allowed into the away end.
[quote][cite]Posted By: ISawLeaburnScore[/cite][quote][cite]Posted By: PL54[/cite]in light of the punishment a few of ours received for arm waving at Norwich, it is laughable that the scum in the East got allowed into the away end.[/quote]
100% spot on[/quote]
Didnt go to game so cant say what happened in east stand, but maybe they will be tracked down at a later date like ours were.
Comments
Not necisarilly i wasnt happy with the result but i felt i defo got my moneys worth.
How stupid. They really could Steward a football match if they got paid to o wait they do joke
Mate of mine came to the game and said the only trouble he saw was Charlton clumping Millwall.
Like i said to oneof the SS types you soon steaming up and dragging some kid out for having a fag or having a sneaky can of beer , now this lot are around you doing F**k all.
Took the piss? Bolox they did. They have been spoutng for ages that there would be a 'tsunami' of Spanners taking over the Valley ... well, they didn't.
Sure there were pockets of them around, that's unavoidable.
But we had more in the home ends of Gillingham than Spanners did at the Valley yesterday.
Actually half of them are forced to take this kind of job or they get no money at all.yes they knew the wage but that dont mean they want to get a smack in the mouth just cos they're earning £7 an hour.Its either get a job or lose your benefits,this is the only kind of work some of them can do
and i reckon we'll have more in the home end at theres aswel, although our pockets of fans wont be dickheads, its been 13 yrs since we played them for christ sake, they are our closest local rivals, there will always be opposing fans in home ends and alike
That was me :-)
[quote][cite]Posted By: uncle[/cite][quote][cite]Posted By: leftbehind[/cite]Uncle
whatever they get paid is not the point they are employed to steward the match and deal with things and they did not.
They knew the wage when they applied they knew what the job was about so they should do there job
Very poor[/quote]
Actually half of them are forced to take this kind of job or they get no money at all.yes they knew the wage but that dont mean they want to get a smack in the mouth just cos they're earning £7 an hour.Its either get a job or lose your benefits,this is the only kind of work some of them can do[/quote]
Ok still be gratful you have a job and do you job end of, 2.5 million out there who would be pleased to have the money and do they job, i know that my work ethic and trust me i have had some badly paid jobs and poor working condtions , BUT i still go to work and do what im emplyeed to do
I'm not directly involved in any of this, but I may have a more informed view from the club's perspective, having been party to the ticketing arrangements and talked yesterday to those whose job it was to manage the event.
How many and when police are in the ground is not a decision for the stewards or the club, it is decided by the police themselves through their senior officer in the control room.
A lot of judgements are being made here on the basis of perception and what individuals witnessed. What most people didn't see was the two mobs of ticketless Millwall removed from the local area after kick-off - estimated at about 250 - few of whom would have merged into the background if they had succeeded in forcing their way in. The fact they didn't have tickets says something of itself about the success of the ticketing precautions.
We do know the some of those who showed out in the east did not have tickets and did not get in through the entrances or exits. The geography of The Valley has made this an issue throughout its history, but it was a small number. I wasn't aware of any Millwall fans around me at all, in contrast to previous games against Arsenal, Chelsea, etc.
We always knew that some Millwall fans would obtain tickets through eligible Charlton fans - not all season-ticket holders - and that some Charlton fans would sell tickets on. I would say that we prevented them gathering in significant numbers in any home area.
That left us to manage those who chose to make themselves known. The majority of stewards are not employed to deal with this issue. They are there to staff the exits and keep gangways clear in accordance with the safety certificate. So you will always get stewards who hold off dealing with any situation while they wait for support. It's also not part of their job to exact retribution, however much it would satisfy some home fans.
I don't agree with the perception that the JS Stand was over capacity. There were empty seats in the bottom left corner of the stand in the first half. But that's just my perception viewed from the east stand and it's no more or less valid than the perception of others in different parts of the ground. The reality is that the security operation around the away end and the CCTV footage of any overcrowding would tell the story.
Finally, people want to know if the club will follow up its promise to deal with any Charlton supporters who provided tickets to away fans and some are already criticising the club on the basis that it won't. Perhaps that judgement should be deferred?
I think you are expecting to much from people who just want a job not get a kick in. Its like expecting a securicor driver when being held up to defend the money he is carrying even if there is a threat of being shot. Just because he gets paid £7 an hour to do so. After all he knows what the job is when he takes it on. Me i would hand the money over but you would obviously rather get shot at least you'd be doing what your paid to do
Brought a nice packed lunch as well, and they call us Anoraks.
yep i saw one of those neanderthal groups ...... i mean they were there for one thing only and it wasn't to watch the footy and if the police/club/stewards hadn't done their job and gotten rid of that scum i genuinely dread to think of what might have happened..... to those who thought it was all over hyped on another day it could have been so so much worse , so well done to the security operation that took place.
i was doing my best impression of a charton away supporter ..... the invisible fan
They stood up and celebrated the first goal. They were highlighted to a steward. Several Charlton supporters made some half-hearted attempts at dealing with them. It was fully ten minutes before the Snatch Squad showed up and eventually removed them.
How would this situation have looked if any Charlton supporters had taken them on and a brawl had occured?
As other posters have said. They're pretty quick off the mark if someone has a sneaky fag or smuggles a capped bottle into the ground.
The idiots in the East Stand should have been arrested and then received banning orders - in light of the punishment a few of ours received for arm waving at Norwich, it is laughable that the scum in the East got allowed into the away end. If they didn't have tickets for the Jimmy Seed then it must breach many rules to have put them in there.
The couple of idiots in the NW were hardly a problem and with all the people counted we're looking at about 30 in a home crowd of 16,000 - hardly the invasion they were claiming so well done to the club on that - still believe the prats in the East should have been nicked though.
Seemed to be something going on outside the Con as I arrived at 245 and the police were full on Special Forces types so if they did genuinely remove 250 from the area then well done to them. The belmarsh stewards were definately in the North Upper as I asked to be directed to my seat and they said we're not here for that and smiled - shame they weren't stationed over in the East as they would have handled that situation with aplomb.
All in all a good day but bad result.
100% spot on
100% spot on[/quote]
Didnt go to game so cant say what happened in east stand, but maybe they will be tracked down at a later date like ours were.
Are you S_E_7 in disguise....arrrrrre you.......