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A few more Questions, if I may...

edited October 2009 in General Charlton
Dodgy form but overall deserved draw with 10 men for us today, if that helps.
Evening all,
A few more questions to top up me programme article for when you visit, if I may...
1) What`s your main catchment area fan base-wise?
2) Do you have a `pet` non-league lower league team? (Always had a soft spot for the likes of Welling & Fisher, can stomach Daggers, but pls don`t say Barnet!)
3) Who was your bearded wonder from the late- / mid- 70`s (the heyday of footie album sticker collecting days)?
4) Did you really have a capacity of 67,000 in the mid-70`s? If so, how come you had such a gigantic ground?
5) Does it p` you off that Brighton consider Palace as rivals (got to be a fair stretch)?
6) Have you managed to attract many non-white ethnic fans to the Valley? (Please excuse me if this is par for the course in the capital these days).
Look forward to a welter of quality replies (not to mention this fab site) judging by last time.
Cheerio,
Andy

Comments

  • BDLBDL
    edited October 2009
    1) Do you have a `pet` non-league lower league team? (Always had a soft spot for the likes of Welling & Fisher, can stomach Daggers, but pls don`t say Barnet!)

    Welling United - Because I lived about a mile from the ground when I was a kid.
    Ebbsfleet United - went to the Trophy final at Wembley a couple of years back and I live in Gravesend so they are my local team I guess ;-). Though they are doing their best to implode this season.

    2) Who was your bearded wonder from the late- / mid- 70`s (the heyday of footie album sticker collecting days)?

    The one, the only..........Killer. Or Johnny Ostergaard, or Keithie P, or Flash. Didn't King Arthur have a beard?

    3) Did you really have a capacity of 67,000 in the mid-70`s? If so, how come you had such a gigantic ground?

    It's in a Valley!

    4) Does it p` you off that Brighton consider Palace as rivals (got to be a fair stretch)?

    Nothing against Brighton - They've gone through the mill over the past few years, lost their ground. Forced to groundshare.

    5) Have you managed to attract many non-white ethnic fans to the Valley? (Please excuse me if this is par for the course in the capital these days).

    Kick it out - Well we started that 17 years ago! So I guess that we have a good mix of fans.
  • [cite]Posted By: northwicher[/cite]Dodgy form but overall deserved draw with 10 men for us today, if that helps.
    Evening all,
    A few more questions to top up me programme article for when you visit, if I may...
    What`s your main catchment area fan base-wise?
    1) Do you have a `pet` non-league lower league team? (Always had a soft spot for the likes of Welling & Fisher, can stomach Daggers, but pls don`t say Barnet!)
    2) Who was your bearded wonder from the late- / mid- 70`s (the heyday of footie album sticker collecting days)?
    3) Did you really have a capacity of 67,000 in the mid-70`s? If so, how come you had such a gigantic ground?
    4) Does it p` you off that Brighton consider Palace as rivals (got to be a fair stretch)?
    5) Have you managed to attract many non-white ethnic fans to the Valley? (Please excuse me if this is par for the course in the capital these days).
    Look forward to a welter of quality replies (not to mention this fab site) judging by last time.
    Cheerio,
    Andy

    Ah, Andy, you come in peace, but may end up opening a can of worms ...
    Catchment ... Southeast London and Kent. Or Kent and Southeast London, depending on who you ask.
    1.) Welling, Ebbsfleet, Bromley, AFC Wimbledon, even. Depends.
    2.) Sir Derek Hales
    3.) Was even bigger than that, with the East Stand the largest in the land.
    4.) Palarse? Brighton? Who they??
    5.) Charlton have been at the forefront of the "Let's Racism Out of "campaign from the start.
  • Sounds like a good scene at your place (which was indeed the case when I did a visit as a UCL student in the mid-80`s - can`t say that for many London grounds) - sincere comments, given the fact I`ve just had to placate my spaniel after a few volleys of Chinese fireworks on the estate here- sad b*****`s!
  • 1 - SE london and nw kent
    2- Dartford top of the league by 14 points I think
    3 - Hales - or is this a trick question!
    4 - yeah - even if we only filled it for the Who!
    5. who cares
    6. the reality is no - we are very much to the forefront of anti racism , there is a large ethnic local community but for the fear of being callled a racist it'd very white at the valley
  • 1) What`s your main catchment area fan base-wise? Greater London into Kent. I remember reading in the Prem days that Bexley and Medway were the areas with most season ticket holders. As said previously a lot of people brought up in SE London have migrated out into Kent because of house prices.

    2) Do you have a `pet` non-league lower league team? (Always had a soft spot for the likes of Welling & Fisher, can stomach Daggers, but pls don`t say Barnet!) Mine is Margate but for most it will be Welling United or Dartford.

    3) Who was your bearded wonder from the late- / mid- 70`s (the heyday of footie album sticker collecting days)? Derek "Killer" Hales who gets plenty of mentions in your legends question on the other thread.

    4) Did you really have a capacity of 67,000 in the mid-70`s? If so, how come you had such a gigantic ground? The Valley is a natural bowl and used to have massive terraces, particularly the East Terace or Bank as it was known.

    5) Does it p` you off that Brighton consider Palace as rivals (got to be a fair stretch)? Don't give a toss what Palace or Brighton think!

    6) Have you managed to attract many non-white ethnic fans to the Valley? (Please excuse me if this is par for the course in the capital these days). Not proportionate to the population make up of SE7 itself but as mentioned above and elsewhere many fans come from Kent which has less non-whites. The Club has certainly made every effort though and as mentioned by others was at the forefront of initiatives like Kick It Out in the early days.
  • Question 4 The east terrace was the biggest in Europe said to hold 40,000 people back in the late 60s and early 70s.Never put to the test since i have been going since 1967.
  • edited November 2009
    Awesome photos of - Derek Hales, I presume - and the ground - which side of the war?
    It`s an absolute classic photo - Proper football ground with a capital `P`. You get the impression (from afar) that the club had very much a working class following in those days, but also that your end of the capital was booming? Perhaps there were many dockers in attendance?
    Just seen.. 1974 - wow, what a year! That`s the sort of scene that got me into footie- it`s far more awe-inspiring than all this cantilever carp that attracts the nouveau riche these days to the PL.
  • [cite]Posted By: northwicher[/cite]
    1) What`s your main catchment area fan base-wise?
    Wherever/Whoever (except near Gillingham. Don't want to upset Scally)
    2) Do you have a `pet` non-league lower league team? (Always had a soft spot for the likes of Welling & Fisher, can stomach Daggers, but pls don`t say Barnet!)
    Personally?.......... no. Only the Addicks for me
    3) Who was your bearded wonder from the late- / mid- 70`s (the heyday of footie album sticker collecting days)? Killer. End of
    4) Did you really have a capacity of 67,000 in the mid-70`s? If so, how come you had such a gigantic ground? The Mighty East Bank
    5) Does it p` you off that Brighton consider Palace as rivals (got to be a fair stretch)?
    Nah. We're quite happy to share our hatred of the nigels!
    6) Have you managed to attract many non-white ethnic fans to the Valley? (Please excuse me if this is par for the course in the capital these days).
    Some minorities, but it's the same with any club I guess. We were one of the 1st (if not the) to introduce the 'Let's Kick It Out' innitiative.
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  • The player is Killer Hales and the ground photo was taken about 1975.
  • Bring back beards. Killer looks like he'd had a heavy night before that was taken.

    I stand to be corrected but you were far more likely to find a docker at Millwall or West Ham. I don't think SE London has ever really 'boomed' as you put it outside of a few areas of prosperity such as Blackheath but I'm from the other side of the water so a true Greenwich resident would better placed to comment.

    Re:the anti-rasicm initiatives, an odd question, but the club pretty much drew up the blueprint for this sort of work 15-20 years ago. Others have implied that we don't get large numbers of black and ethnic fans following us. That may be the case, however there are other factors at play. e.g. the overall size of our support the peer pressure to conform to what your classmates might do if you're a young lad. One thing is for sure and that is I'd have no problem recommending visiting our club to anyone regardless of their colour, etc. They'd be made most welcome and be able to watch the game without worry (occassional idiots aside but these are very rare and likely to be challenged for any out of order comments at our place).
  • The terrace to the right of the photo did go up as high as the terrace that runs along the side of the pitch afew years before this photo was taken, but the club sold the land off to the council to build a tower block.Land was sold about 1972.
  • [cite]Posted By: Off_it[/cite]killer.jpg

    Did this guy have
    [align=center]Zeus[/align]
    [align=center]9[/align]

    on the back of his shirt??
  • 5. As a British Asian and a Charlton fan, there is a fair smattering of "ethnic" fans but not in proportion to the population. That said, despite the odd idiot, I have never felt under threat or insulted at the Valley. To explain the lack of proportional representation from the asian community, 1st generation Asians, both Indian and Pakistani are cricket lovers and soccer has been until recently a minority sport in the sub continent. My dad watched cricket and tolerated me watching match of the day. The problem for future generations is the sky money entices ethinics with no historical affinity to clubs to follow the big 4, so we will do well to bring new supporters from minority communities in, although community and kick it out activities do help.
  • [cite]Posted By: northwicher[/cite]Awesome photos of - Derek Hales, I presume - and the ground - which side of the war?
    It`s an absolute classic photo - Proper football ground with a capital `P`. You get the impression (from afar) that the club had very much a working class following in those days, but also that your end of the capital was booming? Perhaps there were many dockers in attendance?
    Just seen.. 1974 - wow, what a year! That`s the sort of scene that got me into footie- it`s far more awe-inspiring than all this cantilever carp that attracts the nouveau riche these days to the PL.

    Derek "Killer" Hales is our all time leading goalscorer and a legend to those of us of a certain age.

    The area around south and east of the ground rises steeply, creating a natural "amphitheatre" with impressive views of the Thames basin from the top of the terracing in days of that photo and before. Hence, The Valley.
    Charlton frequently attracted attendances of, 50,000, 60,000 and occasionally 70,000 in the boom period after the 2nd world war.
    Our highest average attendance was 40,000 in the late 40's and we are one of only 14 league clubs to achieve this average for a season.
    Of course, we went into a steep decline from the late 50's and attendances fell as low as an average 5,000 during the 70's - kind of made the vast empty spaces quite depressing!
    Support was traditional working class in those days, as with all clubs.
    The big London docks were the other side of the river; so as somebody else said, I don't think we had significant docker support like West Ham or Millwall.
    The Woolwich Arsenal was just down the road and employed hundreds in it''s day, and there was a big Siemens in Woolwich so they may have provided some of our support, but to be honest I don't really know for sure.
  • Evening kick offs were especially great though Six a. The darkness hid the gaps in the terraces and with the floodlights on the atmosphere sent shivers down your spine.

    Remember in particular the Maidstone FA cup tie (good link to Northwich game) when Killer and Flanagan had their punch up and were both sent off, leaving us to finish the game with 9 men! Colin Powell was the man that made things tick for Halesy. What we could do with a winger like him now.
  • [cite]Posted By: Chaz Hill[/cite]Evening kick offs were especially great though Six a. The darkness hid the gaps in the terraces and with the floodlights on the atmosphere sent shivers down your spine.

    Remember in particular the Maidstone FA cup tie (good link to Northwich game) when Killer and Flanagan had their punch up and were both sent off, leaving us to finish the game with 9 men! Colin Powell was the man that made things tick for Halesy. What we could do with a winger like him now.

    what was the result of the match, not fight
  • 1-1. I went to the replay which we won 1-2. Those were the days!
  • Didn't the floodlights fail at the replay?
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  • Long time ago now but now you mention it I think you are right.
  • [cite]Posted By: Chaz Hill[/cite]Evening kick offs were especially great though Six a. The darkness hid the gaps in the terraces and with the floodlights on the atmosphere sent shivers down your spine.

    Remember in particular the Maidstone FA cup tie (good link to Northwich game) when Killer and Flanagan had their punch up and were both sent off, leaving us to finish the game with 9 men! Colin Powell was the man that made things tick for Halesy. What we could do with a winger like him now.

    You're right Chaz, there was a special atmosphere at those night games.
    It always seemed to bring the best out of the players.

    The exception being the Hales/Flanagan punch up as you say; although as I recall only Hales threw a meaningful punch, Flash just tried to defend himself.
  • 4, The crowd was supposed to have been much bigger than 68,000 (against Arsenal). People used to climb over the walls of the houses at the back of the ground and nip under the turnstiles. generally home gates were about 30k, or thereabouts, in the 30's hey days.
    5, It's a mainly white crowd but without racial remarks/discrimination, which are often to be found down the road at Millwall. When ZZ was in the team we had a sprinkling of Chinese visitors, which was good to see. Lots of Danes used to visit to adore Simmonson in the 70's. Likewise, we had a few Portugese in to see Costa when he was on loan.
  • Didn't the Valley hold an FA Cup game where the attendance was over 100,000 and people were falling onto the pitch?? Or did I just make that up?!
  • [cite]Posted By: P_Air[/cite]Didn't the Valley hold an FA Cup game where the attendance was over 100,000 and people were falling onto the pitch?? Or did I just make that up?!

    41,023 watch the equivalent of the quarter final at the Valley in 22/23 season.

    Charlton (then third South ) beat Div 1 Man City, Preston and WBA before losing 1 - 0 to eventual winners Bolton at the Valley.

    Biggest Crowd to date at the Valley (average home league gate was 6,175 that season)

    20 ft of railing collapsed onto the pitch, supposedly as Charlton were about to equalise, and there were a lot of injuries. Legend says that the compensation for the injuries ate up all the money made from the game.

    Pre and post war the area had many factories, the Arsenal and the Woolwich Barracks as well as heavily populated areas of Charlton, Woolwich and other parts of South London to draw support from. Areas such as Eltham were also being developed as commuter suburbs.

    The large number of factories meant that men finishing work Saturday mid-day - still the norm then for working class jobs - had only a short walk or bus/tram ride to the Valley.

    After the war the clubs decline mirrors the closure of the factories and the cut backs in jobs at the Arsenal and other major employers.

    Ironically now the Thames Gateway redevelopment is seen as a vital part of the future growth of the club and is used as a selling point for sponsors and potential takeovers.
    Bolton went on to win the first Wembley Cup Final that year.
  • [cite]Posted By: northwicher[/cite]Dodgy form but overall deserved draw with 10 men for us today, if that helps.
    Evening all,
    A few more questions to top up me programme article for when you visit, if I may...
    1) What`s your main catchment area fan base-wise?
    2) Do you have a `pet` non-league lower league team? (Always had a soft spot for the likes of Welling & Fisher, can stomach Daggers, but pls don`t say Barnet!)
    3) Who was your bearded wonder from the late- / mid- 70`s (the heyday of footie album sticker collecting days)?
    4) Did you really have a capacity of 67,000 in the mid-70`s? If so, how come you had such a gigantic ground?
    5) Does it p` you off that Brighton consider Palace as rivals (got to be a fair stretch)?
    6) Have you managed to attract many non-white ethnic fans to the Valley? (Please excuse me if this is par for the course in the capital these days).
    Look forward to a welter of quality replies (not to mention this fab site) judging by last time.
    Cheerio,
    Andy

    1) Mainly SE London and Kent.
    2) Wow you can stomach Daggers people from essex are hard work mate na for me non league gotta be Welling or Bromley.
    3) Yea Derek Hales mate as the pics show :-)
    4) Yea cos of the terreces we managfed to fit loads into the Valley Seating ruins good grounds like that. We managed to get 75,000 for an FA cup match against Villa in the 30's
    5) Brighton are not at our or Palaces level so they have no room to have rivalry with any London (sorry croyden) team. Dont really care about palace either all i know is their scum.
    6) Yea your right mate its London so their will be a fair few but not as many as in some grounds for some reason. But it doesnt matter what colour they are so long as they support Charlton
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