[quote][cite]Posted By: westie456[/cite]but two be honest pietersen has really done anything special in the matches so far bring in robert key or play a extra bowler like harmy[/quote]
Madness to play an extra bowler. Batting has looked suspect. Joe Denley for me.
hows it madness payin a extra bowler edgebaston for the next test shows you dont no much about cricket then dont it watch the 2005 series and then come back and tell me its madness we played a extra bowler then and guess what we won
[quote][cite]Posted By: westie456[/cite]hows it madness payin a extra bowler edgebaston for the next test shows you dont no much about cricket then dont it watch the 2005 series and then come back and tell me its madness we played a extra bowler then and guess what we won[/quote]
How many bowlers do you want?
Onions and Flintoff have injury doubts, but I might be tempted to drop Broad for Harmison.
[cite]Posted By: westie456[/cite]hows it madness payin a extra bowler edgebaston for the next test shows you dont no much about cricket then dont it watch the 2005 series and then come back and tell me its madness we played a extra bowler then and guess what we won
In 2005 we had 5 bowlers; Harmison, Hoggard, Jones, Flintoff, Giles
In 2009 we have 5 bowlers; Anderson, Broad, Onions, Flintoff, Swann
Playing the extra bowler would give us 6 bowlers, that's too many. It's not as if we need to force a result any more as we're ahead in the series.
We should push Bopara down to 4 and draft in another batsmen with international experience at 3.
[quote][cite]Posted By: Barn Door Varney[/cite][quote][cite]Posted By: Clem_Snide[/cite][quote][cite]Posted By: BlackForestReds[/cite]Up steps Bell then...
Batting at four he should do ok.[/quote]
Bell has consistently struggled against the Aussies. Nothing in his current form to suggest he'll do anything different.[/quote]
Aside from the 600 odd runs he's scored this season at an average of 80![/quote]
Plenty of average batsmen average high numbers in county cricket and can't step up.
Bell was worked out by the Aussies in 2005 and had a nightmare. Averaged around 30 in the return in 2006/7. At the top level he has a history of getting in and getting out.
I've a feeling in all his Ashes Tests (in the UK) at least Bell has batted at #3 for England and struggled, at number four or five he's a wiser choice, most of the runs he's scored for England (easy runs against Bangladesh apart) have been when he bats lower in the order.
[quote][cite]Posted By: westie456[/cite]hows it madness payin a extra bowler edgebaston for the next test shows you dont no much about cricket then dont it watch the 2005 series and then come back and tell me its madness we played a extra bowler then and guess what we won[/quote]
Are you seriously suggesting that we go with 6 bowlers in the next test? Last test was:
Broad, Swann, Onions, Anderson & Flintoff.
Onions & Flintoff are both doubts. If Onions misses out it'll probably be Sidebottom if both miss out then we have a problem!.
[cite]Posted By: BlackForestReds[/cite]Up steps Bell then...
Batting at four he should do ok.
Bell has consistently struggled against the Aussies. Nothing in his current form to suggest he'll do anything different.
Aside from the 600 odd runs he's scored this season at an average of 80!
Plenty of average batsmen average high numbers in county cricket and can't step up.
Bell was worked out by the Aussies in 2005 and had a nightmare. Averaged around 30 in the return in 2006/7. At the top level he has a history of getting in and getting out.
Personal opinion, but I don't rate him.
I actually agree with you but you say that his current form doesn't suggest that he is worth a recall. My point is that he is scoring runs, which is all he can do.
Also this is a hugly different aussie side to the one in 2005 and 2006/7 and Bell's main tourmentors, Warne and McGrath won't be playing.
Bell is ok and potentially/technically is the best batsman in England's squad (including KP) - his problem is that with England playing Swann, Prior, Broad and Flintoff in the lower middle orders and Collingwood batting at five there's no place for him in the line up. Mentally he's not strong enough to bat at #3 and has consistently failed there, one idea might be to move KP from batting at four and going in first wicket down, but he can be a bit loose until he gets his eye in and settles down and if he has to go in and face the new ball then it increases the chance of his going cheaply.
This could be what Bell needs, Australia's bowling isn't as strong as it has been in the last two Ashes series and if he gets the nod, he's got three Tests to rescue his Test career. It'll be down to him to prove hehas the temperament to go with his undoubted ability.
[cite]Posted By: LenGlover[/cite]Bell is probably next in the pecking order followed by Shah.
Moore of Worcestershire is a consistent scorer in county cricket but prefers to open.
As a Kent fan I like Denly but he does get out early on rather too often for my liking at the moment and again he prefers to open.
If Flintoff or Onions are unfit Bresnan (?spelling) of Yorkshire might come in.
Why are you not mentiong Rob Key Len?
I would do normally but other than his 270 against Glamorgan last time out he has had a woeful year with the bat in the 4 day game by his standards and the standards of an aspiring test batsman.
Can't let my natural Kentish bias blind me completely!
[quote][cite]Posted By: BlackForestReds[/cite]Bell is ok and potentially/technically is the best batsman in England's squad (including KP) - his problem is that with England playing Swann, Prior, Broad and Flintoff in the lower middle orders and Collingwood batting at five there's no place for him in the line up. Mentally he's not strong enough to bat at #3 and has consistently failed there, one idea might be to move KP from batting at four and going in first wicket down, but he can be a bit loose until he gets his eye in and settles down and if he has to go in and face the new ball then it increases the chance of his going cheaply.
This could be what Bell needs, Australia's bowling isn't as strong as it has been in the last two Ashes series and if he gets the nod, he's got three Tests to rescue his Test career. It'll be down to him to prove hehas the temperament to go with his undoubted ability.[/quote]
Agreed that the root of Bell's problems are his mental strength. He admitted as much in an interview after the 2005 series.
He has admitted that he was affected by sledging and that he he began to doubt his worth to the team.
If Flintoff or Onions are unfit Bresnan (?spelling) of Yorkshire might come in.
........
I'd prefer Harmison rather than Bresnan. Bresnan is really a first/second change seamer who can bat a bit, I'd rather Harmison was bowling and getting the ball to bounce off a length. Even Flintoff can only generate bounce by bowling back of a length, Harmi can do when pitching the ball up a foot. That would give England some contrasting styles of bowler - Anderson swings the ball both ways and at pace (and therefore it moves late) and Flintoff and Harmison get bounce but from different areas of the pitch.
Compared to Collingwood, Bell is a better batsman by far, but I know who I'd rather have going into bat to save a Test for me, and that's why Collingwood is an automatic write in while Bell gets shuffled around the order when he does play and consistently gets left out.
[cite]Posted By: BlackForestReds[/cite]If Flintoff or Onions are unfit Bresnan (?spelling) of Yorkshire might come in.
........
I'd prefer Harmison rather than Bresnan. Bresnan is really a first/second change seamer who can bat a bit, I'd rather Harmison was bowling and getting the ball to bounce off a length. Even Flintoff can only generate bounce by bowling back of a length, Harmi can do when pitching the ball up a foot. That would give England some contrasting styles of bowler - Anderson swings the ball both ways and at pace (and therefore it moves late) and Flintoff and Harmison get bounce but from different areas of the pitch.
I would too in an ideal world.
However with KP out they might decide they want a bowler who can bat in case Bell /whoever fails.
Comments
Batting at four he should do ok.
Batting at four he should do ok.[/quote]
Bell has consistently struggled against the Aussies. Nothing in his current form to suggest he'll do anything different.
Madness to play an extra bowler. Batting has looked suspect. Joe Denley for me.
Aside from the 600 odd runs he's scored this season at an average of 80!
How many bowlers do you want?
Onions and Flintoff have injury doubts, but I might be tempted to drop Broad for Harmison.
In 2005 we had 5 bowlers; Harmison, Hoggard, Jones, Flintoff, Giles
In 2009 we have 5 bowlers; Anderson, Broad, Onions, Flintoff, Swann
Playing the extra bowler would give us 6 bowlers, that's too many. It's not as if we need to force a result any more as we're ahead in the series.
We should push Bopara down to 4 and draft in another batsmen with international experience at 3.
Batting at four he should do ok.[/quote]
Bell has consistently struggled against the Aussies. Nothing in his current form to suggest he'll do anything different.[/quote]
Aside from the 600 odd runs he's scored this season at an average of 80![/quote]
Plenty of average batsmen average high numbers in county cricket and can't step up.
Bell was worked out by the Aussies in 2005 and had a nightmare. Averaged around 30 in the return in 2006/7. At the top level he has a history of getting in and getting out.
Personal opinion, but I don't rate him.
Are you seriously suggesting that we go with 6 bowlers in the next test? Last test was:
Broad, Swann, Onions, Anderson & Flintoff.
Onions & Flintoff are both doubts. If Onions misses out it'll probably be Sidebottom if both miss out then we have a problem!.
I actually agree with you but you say that his current form doesn't suggest that he is worth a recall. My point is that he is scoring runs, which is all he can do.
Also this is a hugly different aussie side to the one in 2005 and 2006/7 and Bell's main tourmentors, Warne and McGrath won't be playing.
Moore of Worcestershire is a consistent scorer in county cricket but prefers to open.
As a Kent fan I like Denly but he does get out early on rather too often for my liking at the moment and again he prefers to open.
If Flintoff or Onions are unfit Bresnan (?spelling) of Yorkshire might come in.
This could be what Bell needs, Australia's bowling isn't as strong as it has been in the last two Ashes series and if he gets the nod, he's got three Tests to rescue his Test career. It'll be down to him to prove hehas the temperament to go with his undoubted ability.
Fat Bob has certainly done that a few times over the years:-)
Why are you not mentiong Rob Key Len?
I would do normally but other than his 270 against Glamorgan last time out he has had a woeful year with the bat in the 4 day game by his standards and the standards of an aspiring test batsman.
Can't let my natural Kentish bias blind me completely!
This could be what Bell needs, Australia's bowling isn't as strong as it has been in the last two Ashes series and if he gets the nod, he's got three Tests to rescue his Test career. It'll be down to him to prove hehas the temperament to go with his undoubted ability.[/quote]
Agreed that the root of Bell's problems are his mental strength. He admitted as much in an interview after the 2005 series.
He has admitted that he was affected by sledging and that he he began to doubt his worth to the team.
........
I'd prefer Harmison rather than Bresnan. Bresnan is really a first/second change seamer who can bat a bit, I'd rather Harmison was bowling and getting the ball to bounce off a length. Even Flintoff can only generate bounce by bowling back of a length, Harmi can do when pitching the ball up a foot. That would give England some contrasting styles of bowler - Anderson swings the ball both ways and at pace (and therefore it moves late) and Flintoff and Harmison get bounce but from different areas of the pitch.
Ok two good innings. Still poor the rest of the time though.
I guess he has got test experience though which is an advantage.
I would too in an ideal world.
However with KP out they might decide they want a bowler who can bat in case Bell /whoever fails.
The Aussies don't rate him at all and seeing 'the Sherminator' striding to the crease instead of KP will give them a massive boost.
For me, this news puts the series back in the balance as KP is our best batsman by a long way - make no mistake about that.
Yeah, Freddie is not world I guess!?