[cite]Posted By: LargeAddick[/cite]not a lot else to say. If we had lost 3-0 or 4-0 we couldn't have complained, we were shocking. Ipswich's finishing was woeful. Some of their chances were so easy they made Varney's on Saturday look difficult. Hudson, Cranie, Holland and Bailey played well, Weaver reedemmed himself with the pen save and Varney worked his socks off. The others were pants. Previously I'd thought Youga a clown but I realise now he is really a juggler in disguise.
If we had lost the 'we want Pardew out' chants would have been quite widespread imo. I didn't join in during the game but would have at the end if we had lost. His constant team changes are getting ridiculous. I still believe we have a decent enough top-six squad and if that is the case then we are under-performing and the blame for that can only be laid at one person's door.
Totally agree this squad shouldnt be in this position......I said last season that the buck stops with the management and training staff, but over the course of the close season I decided to put all that aside and give the manager the chance to impress me. Sadly that hasnt happened, we are sliding backwards and in my opinion if AP had any pride at all he would walk. I still stand by my comment that maybe this could be the turning point...play badly and snatch a draw when staring defeat full in the face, but then again Im an Optimist :-)
hes got three more games for me before we all hate him .....
the board cant sack him though...... if the board sack him ill be fucking furious as we need every penny and to give that guy a million for not doing anything at all id be angry....
anyone know how much it would cost us to sack him???
Pards' ego will never let him walk and why would he when he knows he would get a minty pay off if he sticks around until things get really really bad. I actually think he is trying his hardest, but just cannot get the right blend in the team and what has worked for him at West Ham and Reading is not working at all for him here. I think he fancies himself as a bit of a Wenger (spelt correctly! ;)), bringing in young players that appear to have a bit of potential with the intention of turning them into really decent players. Trick is Arsenal's coaching team is miles ahead of our set up and I really don't think we get the most out of these potential stars. Youga when he came back from Scunthorpe versus now for example.
I actually think Curbs was a bit he same. Parker's loan to Norwich was the turning point in his step up. Before then, lovely skill, no tackling etc.
We have to dig in for the time being and start clocking up points with a view to survival, sad to say, but the Board must continue to assess what it wants for Charlton, which I know is the best it can be, because without investment in this team or a fresh approach to managing the team, whether that is a change in Pards' backroom staff or the manager himself, we are heading into really lowly times.
Anyone know why Basey was dropped? Youga has been shocking in recent games so Pardew drops him for one game then brings him back in. That sends out a great message to Basey doesn't it, and also tells Youga no matter how sh*t you are, you'll be back in the team soon anyway.
Dickson is sub all season, then when he's due a start, he gets bombed out so McLeod can start, then gets put back on the bench for tuesday with McLeod not even in the squad. And people reckon we've turned a corner?
If Ipswich hadn't all been clearly taking lessons from the Lisbie School of Accuracy, they would have won by a few goals last night
But somehow we got the one shot we were singing for and we scored and we could have gone on and won it, amazingly enough
We were pretty awful, but if Pardew starts with the team that finished this game, for God's sake, maybe we can get a win on Saturday.
We have to play better than this, but just maybe, maybe maybe it will start a bit of a roll.
3b we all hope your right mate but it seems someone says the same thing game after game --- he (Pards) really has no idea of what his team or what best 11 should be--- they players know that and they never know who or what will happen from game to game.
[cite]Posted By: Goonerhater[/cite]3b we all hope your right mate but it seems someone says the same thing game after game --- he (Pards) really has no idea of what his team or what best 11 should be--- they players know that and they never know who or what will happen from game to game.
That's still one of the major problems.
We've got so many inconsistent players that we can never have a best 11. We've got players who should be starting every week, then they'll go an have an awful game.
I hadn't really thought of that before but you're spot on.
I bet if you asked 50 people on here for their best 11 you'd probably get 50 different answers.
and that is mainly down to very few of our players playing with any consistency.
Everyone has got their favorites but only Weaver, Hudson and Bailey play with enough consistency that they've nailed down their place.
lets remember that we only see whats on the pitch for 90 minutes. we dont know about the attitudes, the training ability or the fitness of players, we don't know who is under the weather, on top of their game etc etc.
pards does see the majority of that and makes his mind up based on that, sometimes he gets it right, sometimes not. I'm not saying we can't all have an opinion on what we think the best 11 is, but some people suggest they know better than pards and the management team, and I don't see how that can be?
there are people that i sit next to that offer 3 different opinions on just 1 player, so choosing a perfect 11 i'm sure is harder than it looks!
Yeah that's fair comment, but whilst we don't know what happens in training, during practice and watching the real matches, watching your squad as a pro, you SHOULD be able to pick out the players who are going to do something for you on the day.
I know it's easy to say all this, and I do agree that there are some inconsistent players in our squad, and sometimes you get the right comination by chance when they just start to click as a team. But something is going pretty wrong with the teams we are sending out.
It seems to be lack of confidence, a bit of motivation, something is just not happening. I don't think it is lack of skill. It seems to be a lack of understanding between players, and an understanding what their individual roles are. If the team is continually tinkered with, then that is unlikely to get better.
For the last 20 mins on Tuesday we looked more balanced, and much more of a possible threat going forward.
And if I was Pardew, I'd take the pragmatic approach and just think well, let's see what those players can do on Sat, because we were going nowhere before the changes he made.
I think we can turn it around, I really do, it just needs to start happening.
[cite]Posted By: Goonerhater[/cite]3b we all hope your right mate but it seems someone says the same thing game after game --- he (Pards) really has no idea of what his team or what best 11 should be--- they players know that and they never know who or what will happen from game to game.
That's still one of the major problems.
We've got so many inconsistent players that we can never have a best 11. We've got players who should be starting every week, then they'll go an have an awful game.
I said consistency was going to be an issue right at the start of the season from looking at the squad - on their day, most can be very good players. On off days, they can be poor to calamitous (even Bailey/Hudson/Weaver, though the latter two have fewer off days). So how do you build consistency? Sorry to be a broken record - build on strengths, work on weaknesses and grow confidence - it's the manager's job!!
[cite]Posted By: 3blokes[/cite]Yeah that's fair comment, but whilst we don't know what happens in training, during practice and watching the real matches, watching your squad as a pro, you SHOULD be able to pick out the players who are going to do something for you on the day.
I know it's easy to say all this, and I do agree that there are some inconsistent players in our squad, and sometimes you get the right comination by chance when they just start to click as a team. But something is going pretty wrong with the teams we are sending out.
It seems to be lack of confidence, a bit of motivation, something is just not happening. I don't think it is lack of skill. It seems to be a lack of understanding between players, and an understanding what their individual roles are. If the team is continually tinkered with, then that is unlikely to get better.
For the last 20 mins on Tuesday we looked more balanced, and much more of a possible threat going forward.
And if I was Pardew, I'd take the pragmatic approach and just think well, let's see what those players can do on Sat, because we were going nowhere before the changes he made.
I think we can turn it around, I really do, it just needs to start happening.
spot on start with the team that ended the game minus youga for basey.
The need is to play to strengths and cover weaknesses by setting the pattern of play enabling players to contribute by getting a job done. A step down memory lane with four examples
Derek Hales - a success before he moved, we played to his aggression & pace. For Derby, West Ham as orthodox inside forward he was just ok. Coming back (twice the player who left) we again focus on his strengths. He became a legend.
Pardew himself was different, no excessive skill, he rarely stood out but with box to box work rate, always available, and a few goals he got the job done.
Steve Gritt built a career on getting the job done once said when he played for Mike Bailey he often felt he knew exactly where every teammate would be.
Kishishev despite his many critics earned a place because he adapted his style to do a job. Often it was downright ugly but he looked a right pain to play against.
The key – they knew their job and the side knew how to play to them.
The Mike Bailey example may be over the top but I do not see that clarity or understanding in us at the moment and suggest it is nigh on impossible when a team is constantly changing.
No one says it is easy – it is not but I expect to see a better understanding of the players we have and how they are used.
Comments
Totally agree this squad shouldnt be in this position......I said last season that the buck stops with the management and training staff, but over the course of the close season I decided to put all that aside and give the manager the chance to impress me. Sadly that hasnt happened, we are sliding backwards and in my opinion if AP had any pride at all he would walk. I still stand by my comment that maybe this could be the turning point...play badly and snatch a draw when staring defeat full in the face, but then again Im an Optimist :-)
the board cant sack him though......
if the board sack him ill be fucking furious as we need every penny and to give that guy a million for not doing anything at all id be angry....
anyone know how much it would cost us to sack him???
:-)
I actually think Curbs was a bit he same. Parker's loan to Norwich was the turning point in his step up. Before then, lovely skill, no tackling etc.
We have to dig in for the time being and start clocking up points with a view to survival, sad to say, but the Board must continue to assess what it wants for Charlton, which I know is the best it can be, because without investment in this team or a fresh approach to managing the team, whether that is a change in Pards' backroom staff or the manager himself, we are heading into really lowly times.
---------------------------------Weaver------------------------------------
Semedo---------Primus/Cranie----------Hudson-----------------Basey
-----------Wright--------------Bailey-------------Holland----------------
--------------------------------Varney-------------------------------------
-----------------------Mcleod---------Dickson---------------------------
Go for it Pards!
Dickson is sub all season, then when he's due a start, he gets bombed out so McLeod can start, then gets put back on the bench for tuesday with McLeod not even in the squad. And people reckon we've turned a corner?
But somehow we got the one shot we were singing for and we scored and we could have gone on and won it, amazingly enough
We were pretty awful, but if Pardew starts with the team that finished this game, for God's sake, maybe we can get a win on Saturday.
We have to play better than this, but just maybe, maybe maybe it will start a bit of a roll.
That's still one of the major problems.
We've got so many inconsistent players that we can never have a best 11. We've got players who should be starting every week, then they'll go an have an awful game.
I bet if you asked 50 people on here for their best 11 you'd probably get 50 different answers.
and that is mainly down to very few of our players playing with any consistency.
Everyone has got their favorites but only Weaver, Hudson and Bailey play with enough consistency that they've nailed down their place.
pards does see the majority of that and makes his mind up based on that, sometimes he gets it right, sometimes not. I'm not saying we can't all have an opinion on what we think the best 11 is, but some people suggest they know better than pards and the management team, and I don't see how that can be?
there are people that i sit next to that offer 3 different opinions on just 1 player, so choosing a perfect 11 i'm sure is harder than it looks!
Well that's a decent start with the spine of the side in place - a keeper, centreback, centremid.
Then we need a centreforward to be indispensible - and at least one winger who can get to the byeline and actually cross the ball?
I know it's easy to say all this, and I do agree that there are some inconsistent players in our squad, and sometimes you get the right comination by chance when they just start to click as a team. But something is going pretty wrong with the teams we are sending out.
It seems to be lack of confidence, a bit of motivation, something is just not happening. I don't think it is lack of skill. It seems to be a lack of understanding between players, and an understanding what their individual roles are. If the team is continually tinkered with, then that is unlikely to get better.
For the last 20 mins on Tuesday we looked more balanced, and much more of a possible threat going forward.
And if I was Pardew, I'd take the pragmatic approach and just think well, let's see what those players can do on Sat, because we were going nowhere before the changes he made.
I think we can turn it around, I really do, it just needs to start happening.
I said consistency was going to be an issue right at the start of the season from looking at the squad - on their day, most can be very good players. On off days, they can be poor to calamitous (even Bailey/Hudson/Weaver, though the latter two have fewer off days). So how do you build consistency? Sorry to be a broken record - build on strengths, work on weaknesses and grow confidence - it's the manager's job!!
spot on start with the team that ended the game minus youga for basey.
Derek Hales - a success before he moved, we played to his aggression & pace. For Derby, West Ham as orthodox inside forward he was just ok. Coming back (twice the player who left) we again focus on his strengths. He became a legend.
Pardew himself was different, no excessive skill, he rarely stood out but with box to box work rate, always available, and a few goals he got the job done.
Steve Gritt built a career on getting the job done once said when he played for Mike Bailey he often felt he knew exactly where every teammate would be.
Kishishev despite his many critics earned a place because he adapted his style to do a job. Often it was downright ugly but he looked a right pain to play against.
The key – they knew their job and the side knew how to play to them.
The Mike Bailey example may be over the top but I do not see that clarity or understanding in us at the moment and suggest it is nigh on impossible when a team is constantly changing.
No one says it is easy – it is not but I expect to see a better understanding of the players we have and how they are used.
Grapevine 49
Is that down to the iconsistency of the players or the inconsistency of Pardew's selections?
Or are the inconsistencies in his selections due to the inconsistencies of the players?
Or are the inconsistencies of the players down to the inconsistencies of Pardew's selection policy?
I confess I am almost as confused as our manager appears to be...
Except no-one is paying you the best part of £1 million a year to be confused, nigel ;-)