All makes a lot of sense. Good to see that Derek has just signed up to this site too. I see you are currently online Derek, tell us how much of a shock it was to receive that news from Zabeel on Wednesday.
Thanks Ken for that impressive assesment as to why the club has been struggling for the last few years and your low opinion of our board.
Yeah Ken................ thanks again pal!
Have to say I totally echo your comments regarding the board and decisions that have been made since Curbs left.
The problem we have now is where to do we go from here..The board are Charlton through and through and given the farce of the last few weeks the idea of foreign ownership has certainly become less appealing to me.
Consider this, as DC said himself, there is friendly debt of £6m, all from their own pockets, I would imagine its a thankless task sitting on the board, no doubt it has its rewards every now & then, but on the whole a thankless task.
I have sat on many committees for social clubs, football clubs etc, and what people fail to realise is that you give what is essentially your free time to the task for the greater good of all, and you cant please everybody, Rock Spectacle and Henry will tell you that, from working with the club and Rocks other involvement at the Cons club.
We could be sitting 3rd in the Premier League, FA Cup quarter finalists, Semis of the EUFA cup and some people would still find something to moan about. Some of the people on the board dragged this club from the depths of despair to what it is now, take a look back, those of you who were there at Woolwich Town Hall, Selhurst Park with 3000 other diehards week in week out, and standing on the derelict Valley pitch on theat cold March Sunday morning clean up in 1989, look at what we have now, we have these people and our own efforts to thank for that.
We have been through far far far worse than a POTENTIAL buyer pulling out, recent results dim the picture, but take a deep breath, sit back and really think about it.
I'm all for criticising people when its deserved, and I hate the idea of blindly supporting anything, dangerous IMO, however, I dont think the board have done anything wrong, they are at heart all Charlton fanatics. They have backed managers and thrown money behind the managers recommendations, we all know who we are talking about here, thats where the money was wasted in the last couple of years.
Peoples perceptions are dimmed by recent results, and I for one blame the current football management, coaches & squad, they are all under acheiving big time presently, and some supporters for some reason start blaming the board, I dont.
Gotta agree with Ken.No doubt about it,the board are died in red Charlton fans,but over the last couple of years we have seen just how much curbs made our football club tick.
I suppose you could argue that the board picked Curbs for the job in the first place.But at that time, how long was the list of candidates?
I disagree that the player sales and other cuts were made solely to make the club attractive to an external buyer. The club decided to balance the budget to avoid the type of financial disaster that we have seen at other clubs. Another painful adjustment will be needed if and when the parachute money runs out in the summer.
Yes, that could also make the club more attractive to an external buyer but IMHO that was not the sole reason for the balancing of the budget. The board will be aware that they can not guarentee that an external buyer will come in so have to plan for the quite possible scenario of being in this division, with no parachute money and them still being in charge.
The board have to take the blame, and they have, for their mistakes such as Dowie and Reed although many of the people who are now Pardew's fiercest critics were his biggest champions when the board recruited him including you Ken. His track record and his public announcements were hailed as fantastically honest and insightful by many who now bemoan his "spin".
But the board are also, literally, paying for their mistakes by putting another £14.5m into the bond scheme in the summer. That is the "friendly" debt that Chappell mentioned with the reminder of the £20m being a mortgage so a more manageable debt. Prudence after a lack of the same perhaps but prudence still.
I still wish that the Zebeel deal had gone thru but unless someone else is willing to take on the role we have the board we have warts and all.
[cite]Posted By: DA9[/cite]Consider this, as DC said himself, there is friendly debt of £6m, all from their own pockets, I would imagine its a thankless task sitting on the board, no doubt it has its rewards every now & then, but on the whole a thankless task.
Just to clear this point up, as I understand it the friendly debt is £15M being the converable bonds announced last year, the only other debt is a £6M mortgage.
The club has come a long way from the previously published debt of £45M shown in the last R&A.
We have to also bear in mind that the debt figure is not "net debt", i.e. the club have assets such as the ground which means the balance sheet is very healthy. They have had to reduce debt so that the costs of servicing it can be met from revenue and thus the club is able to live within it's means.
In the future though, if we don't get promoted this season, our revenues will fall again by several millions and the club will need to cut costs further to ensure that they can meet all their costs including payment of the mortgage.
I know people want the club to spend more on the squad, and keep hold of players who have a significant sales value but not to have taken the action that was taken, the club would truely have been in the fertiliser. That was the primary reason for the action taken. As a corollary to this, it may have made the club a more saleable proposition.
[cite]Posted By: Oggy Red[/cite]After the Board has taken action to correct their own freely admitted past mistakes, they can now only be accused of good housekeeping.
What else would people have them do at this point ...... ?
Agreed Oggy but still some people seem to doubt the motives for prudence and some, not necessarily on here, are suggesting they will sell off more players in January to pay back the long-term convertable loans, they themselves have committed to the club. This nonsense needs to be challenged. Cuts will come because of the need to balance the books, and to ensure the club lives within it's means. Those are the financial home truths of a club two seasons out of the Premier League.
[cite]Posted By: bingaddick[/cite]We have to also bear in mind that the debt figure is not "net debt", i.e. the club have assets such as the ground which means the balance sheet is very healthy.
In contrast to a club like Palarse, who own nuffink of value. Nuffink! No ground, no training ground. Not so much as a tanning salon to underwrite their operating debt.
Oggy, I don't want to see our best players go, neither, I'm sure does Pards or the Board. We still have a big squad when benchmarked against others in this division who are making a better fist of things than us at the moment.
We have some youngsters, at last, who are looking like breaking into the team. Josh Wright had a decent debut yesterday, Jonjo surely will get another chance shortly. We also have players who are quality but just aren't performing anything like at the level we might expect. We also have some injured players unavailable. If Pards doesn't get them playing as a team and rising up the table, we will be in the scheisse and that will put more pressure on the finances. The performance in the second half yesterday does give some grounds for hope.
Pards has to get the coaching and the tactics right, whether we have a big squad or a trimmed one and he hasn't convinced me yet that he has achieved this. If he doesn't players sold or otherwise, we will be in for a pretty difficult time.
Comments
Yeah Ken................ thanks again pal!
Wrong side of bed this morning ?
;-)
Have to say I totally echo your comments regarding the board and decisions that have been made since Curbs left.
The problem we have now is where to do we go from here..The board are Charlton through and through and given the farce of the last few weeks the idea of foreign ownership has certainly become less appealing to me.
I have sat on many committees for social clubs, football clubs etc, and what people fail to realise is that you give what is essentially your free time to the task for the greater good of all, and you cant please everybody, Rock Spectacle and Henry will tell you that, from working with the club and Rocks other involvement at the Cons club.
We could be sitting 3rd in the Premier League, FA Cup quarter finalists, Semis of the EUFA cup and some people would still find something to moan about. Some of the people on the board dragged this club from the depths of despair to what it is now, take a look back, those of you who were there at Woolwich Town Hall, Selhurst Park with 3000 other diehards week in week out, and standing on the derelict Valley pitch on theat cold March Sunday morning clean up in 1989, look at what we have now, we have these people and our own efforts to thank for that.
We have been through far far far worse than a POTENTIAL buyer pulling out, recent results dim the picture, but take a deep breath, sit back and really think about it.
I back the board 100%
Some people have very short memories.
Peoples perceptions are dimmed by recent results, and I for one blame the current football management, coaches & squad, they are all under acheiving big time presently, and some supporters for some reason start blaming the board, I dont.
I suppose you could argue that the board picked Curbs for the job in the first place.But at that time, how long was the list of candidates?
Yes, that could also make the club more attractive to an external buyer but IMHO that was not the sole reason for the balancing of the budget. The board will be aware that they can not guarentee that an external buyer will come in so have to plan for the quite possible scenario of being in this division, with no parachute money and them still being in charge.
The board have to take the blame, and they have, for their mistakes such as Dowie and Reed although many of the people who are now Pardew's fiercest critics were his biggest champions when the board recruited him including you Ken. His track record and his public announcements were hailed as fantastically honest and insightful by many who now bemoan his "spin".
But the board are also, literally, paying for their mistakes by putting another £14.5m into the bond scheme in the summer. That is the "friendly" debt that Chappell mentioned with the reminder of the £20m being a mortgage so a more manageable debt. Prudence after a lack of the same perhaps but prudence still.
I still wish that the Zebeel deal had gone thru but unless someone else is willing to take on the role we have the board we have warts and all.
Good to hear, not what the media have been spinning!
Just to clear this point up, as I understand it the friendly debt is £15M being the converable bonds announced last year, the only other debt is a £6M mortgage.
The club has come a long way from the previously published debt of £45M shown in the last R&A.
We have to also bear in mind that the debt figure is not "net debt", i.e. the club have assets such as the ground which means the balance sheet is very healthy. They have had to reduce debt so that the costs of servicing it can be met from revenue and thus the club is able to live within it's means.
In the future though, if we don't get promoted this season, our revenues will fall again by several millions and the club will need to cut costs further to ensure that they can meet all their costs including payment of the mortgage.
I know people want the club to spend more on the squad, and keep hold of players who have a significant sales value but not to have taken the action that was taken, the club would truely have been in the fertiliser. That was the primary reason for the action taken. As a corollary to this, it may have made the club a more saleable proposition.
What else would people have them do at this point ...... ?
Agreed Oggy but still some people seem to doubt the motives for prudence and some, not necessarily on here, are suggesting they will sell off more players in January to pay back the long-term convertable loans, they themselves have committed to the club. This nonsense needs to be challenged. Cuts will come because of the need to balance the books, and to ensure the club lives within it's means. Those are the financial home truths of a club two seasons out of the Premier League.
In contrast to a club like Palarse, who own nuffink of value. Nuffink! No ground, no training ground. Not so much as a tanning salon to underwrite their operating debt.
Great post bing.
But next summer, if we don't turn our season round, could look ominous.
We have some youngsters, at last, who are looking like breaking into the team. Josh Wright had a decent debut yesterday, Jonjo surely will get another chance shortly. We also have players who are quality but just aren't performing anything like at the level we might expect. We also have some injured players unavailable. If Pards doesn't get them playing as a team and rising up the table, we will be in the scheisse and that will put more pressure on the finances. The performance in the second half yesterday does give some grounds for hope.
Pards has to get the coaching and the tactics right, whether we have a big squad or a trimmed one and he hasn't convinced me yet that he has achieved this. If he doesn't players sold or otherwise, we will be in for a pretty difficult time.