premiership...
every year i thought we'd go down but he managed to get enough results to keep us up in the big time , i actually thought dowie would keep us up but he wasn't to be given time so , who knows
and i know if curbs was here i wouldn't have received a load of texts from palace fans rubbing my nose in it, cos we'd be above that lot for sure
[cite]Posted By: oohaahmortimer[/cite]premiership...
every year i thought we'd go down but he managed to get enough results to keep us up in the big time , i actually thought dowie would keep us up but he wasn't to be given time so , who knows
and i know if curbs was here i wouldn't have received a load of texts from palace fans rubbing my nose in it, cos we'd be above that lot for sure
I think Curbs was close to burning out and needed a break. Just look at the pictures of him when he left and 6 months later when he joined West Ham
As for Dowie. I know you keep on about he would have kept us up if he had been given more time but two things. he was sacked for non-footballing reasons (most of which are in the public domain now in any case) and we were terrible under him. We were bottom of the table when he went and looking poor everywhere.
If you are looking for one turning point it wasn't Parker going, Curbs going, pardew coming or Ried going it was appointing Dowie. We were always going to be at our most vulnerable when Curbs went and we got the wrong man in every sort of way.
Premiership.......he never once had the sort of money the last two mangers (Excluding Reed as he wasnt a manager in any transfer window) have had. To me thats an insult Curbishley after what he achieved and with what resources he had, however looking at what he has had at West Ham good job really, mind you saved them last season a team in which Pardew was taking down, and has turnt them into a mid table club, he has done more for them than what Pardew has done for us.
That was the team from Curb's last match in charge - the 4-0 drubbing at Old Trafford - it was a team that drastically needed freshening up & Dowie attempted to do this, but by & large bought terribly - Traore, Faye, JFH etc.
2005/06 was a disaster if you recall - we got off to a superb start - but from November - May that season, our points per game would have comfortably relegated us.
Curbs would have had to drastically rebuild in the summer of 2006 - if he had been fully motivated & committed to the cause, I expect he would have purchased much more wisely than Dowie - however he was long, past his care-by date by May 2006.
The key to our downfall was the inability to
(a). improve this poor squad during 2005/2006
(b). the shockingly bad purchasing under Dowie
you can only really judge him on his record and that is building sides and keeping them in the prem,something he is doing now at whu. his ability to get to 40 points would have kept us up again and whu would not have had such a good manager to replace pardew who was sending them down.all this without the bumper spending that has been thrown at dowie and pardew.
absolutely no doubt we would be in the premier(shit?) now.
his signings bar Darren Bent were well below his usual standard, bringing in Bryan Hughes as a replacement for Claus Jensen was one that springs to mind and the quality of football was bloody boring compared to the previous years.
Premiershop - just above the danger zone. The Premiership has got a bit tougher since Curbs left. There are one or two less weaker team notwithstanding Derby's appalling season
Premiership - just above the danger zone. The Premiership has got a bit tougher since Curbs left. There are one or two less weaker team notwithstanding Derby's appalling season. However, I think we would just about be hanging on in there.
I agree we did look very poor at the end of his term but this was something that had occurred at the year of a few Prem seasons under Curbs, but he always managed to bring in 2 or 3 signings the following year that gave us a fresh look and would ensure we would be safe by March at the latest.
He managed the knack of always keeping us up so I have to say if he had stayed it is likely we would have remianed in the league.
This is one of those impossible questions to answer because he was never going to stay so what was not done with regard to rebuilding has to be looked at in that light.
Curbs had made his mind up to go, in my view, the season before he actually went. I think the loss of Parker, then DiCanio help to make up his mind. I believe the Board pursuaded him to give it a go given his contract had two more years to run and made some cash available which resulted in the purchase of Darren Bent. The fiasco of Murphy's and Smertin's premature departures will have finished any lingering doubts he had. I think that Curbs always knew that he would not serve his final year and thus he never planned any further forward. The squad was threadbare in many respects but because he wasn't staying, he didn't look any further forward.
So to answer the question. If, hypothetically Curbs had seen his future lay with staying for a few more years, then he would have planned to have a stronger team than there was when he departed and yes, we would have remained in the Premier League with reasonable ease. If he had the same squad that Dowie inherited, I think he would have kept that that team up although with a struggle. What would have happened is that he's have bought more wisely than Dowie and being much more secure in his position with the Board, would have lasted out the season. We would not have had the disasterous period with Les in charge, and would have garnered a few more points at that stage, leaving the task of picking enough points up in the second half of the season much less onerous.
Championship, look at the squad he left us with, there were only a handful of genuine Premiership class players left (Hermann, D.Bent, Young) and some players who were nowhere near good enough for that level.
[cite]Posted By: Ormiston Addick[/cite]Championship, look at the squad he left us with, there were only a handful of genuine Premiership class players left (Hermann, D.Bent, Young) and some players who were nowhere near good enough for that level.
they still got 47 points in that season, somehow!!
[quote][cite]Posted By: Ormiston Addick[/cite]Championship, look at the squad he left us with, there were only a handful of genuine Premiership class players left (Hermann, D.Bent, Young) and some players who were nowhere near good enough for that level.[/quote]
Yes, OAM, that is quite true and please believe me - I am second to no man in my love and admiration for Curbs and what he did for our club.
But when you look back on that 2005/06 season you can see quite clearly that we won 6 from our first 9 games and then only won another 8 from the remaining 29 games (and lost 16 of them) which is veering toward relegation form whichever way you look at it.
Moreover, you could already see the weaknesses emerging in our post-Parker midfield with the 5-2 debacle at The Valley against Man City as well as the Carling Cup loss to Blackburn when were 2-0 up and lost 3-2 - but we did nothing to address that weakness.
The decline was there for all to see from having Dean Kiely as keeper we suddenly had the untried Stephen Andersen and past it Tommy Myhre. From having Rufus/Fish/Costa as our centre-halves we suddenly had El Karkouri/Sorondo/Perry. In midfield we went from quality like Parker/Jensen (both of whom left us for Premiership clubs) to Hughes/Holland/Kishishev (none of whom would have had a prayer of playing for another Premiership club). The only exception to the rule was the front two where the Bent-Bent combination should have been, on paper at least, the best pairing we ever had in the Premiership.
So, sorry to have to disagree, but Curbs has to have his share of the blame for not maintaining a better quality squad in those final years and making too many bad buys (Jeffers, Rommedhal, El Karkouri, Hughes, M. Bent etc) and too few good ones apart from the excellent D. Bent.
Comments
Hypothetically of course.
If he had the money that Dowie did that summer tho, now that would be a different hypothetical question
every year i thought we'd go down but he managed to get enough results to keep us up in the big time , i actually thought dowie would keep us up but he wasn't to be given time so , who knows
and i know if curbs was here i wouldn't have received a load of texts from palace fans rubbing my nose in it, cos we'd be above that lot for sure
I think Curbs was close to burning out and needed a break. Just look at the pictures of him when he left and 6 months later when he joined West Ham
As for Dowie. I know you keep on about he would have kept us up if he had been given more time but two things. he was sacked for non-footballing reasons (most of which are in the public domain now in any case) and we were terrible under him. We were bottom of the table when he went and looking poor everywhere.
If you are looking for one turning point it wasn't Parker going, Curbs going, pardew coming or Ried going it was appointing Dowie. We were always going to be at our most vulnerable when Curbs went and we got the wrong man in every sort of way.
Subs not used Randolph,Bothroyd,
That was the team from Curb's last match in charge - the 4-0 drubbing at Old Trafford - it was a team that drastically needed freshening up & Dowie attempted to do this, but by & large bought terribly - Traore, Faye, JFH etc.
2005/06 was a disaster if you recall - we got off to a superb start - but from November - May that season, our points per game would have comfortably relegated us.
Curbs would have had to drastically rebuild in the summer of 2006 - if he had been fully motivated & committed to the cause, I expect he would have purchased much more wisely than Dowie - however he was long, past his care-by date by May 2006.
The key to our downfall was the inability to
(a). improve this poor squad during 2005/2006
(b). the shockingly bad purchasing under Dowie
absolutely no doubt we would be in the premier(shit?) now.
his signings bar Darren Bent were well below his usual standard, bringing in Bryan Hughes as a replacement for Claus Jensen was one that springs to mind and the quality of football was bloody boring compared to the previous years.
That hasnt changed much to be honest :o(
better than chumpionship possibly flirting with relegation i have lost my faith
FFS CHANGE THE FU8K8NG RECORD!!!!
He managed the knack of always keeping us up so I have to say if he had stayed it is likely we would have remianed in the league.
Curbs had made his mind up to go, in my view, the season before he actually went. I think the loss of Parker, then DiCanio help to make up his mind. I believe the Board pursuaded him to give it a go given his contract had two more years to run and made some cash available which resulted in the purchase of Darren Bent. The fiasco of Murphy's and Smertin's premature departures will have finished any lingering doubts he had. I think that Curbs always knew that he would not serve his final year and thus he never planned any further forward. The squad was threadbare in many respects but because he wasn't staying, he didn't look any further forward.
So to answer the question. If, hypothetically Curbs had seen his future lay with staying for a few more years, then he would have planned to have a stronger team than there was when he departed and yes, we would have remained in the Premier League with reasonable ease. If he had the same squad that Dowie inherited, I think he would have kept that that team up although with a struggle. What would have happened is that he's have bought more wisely than Dowie and being much more secure in his position with the Board, would have lasted out the season. We would not have had the disasterous period with Les in charge, and would have garnered a few more points at that stage, leaving the task of picking enough points up in the second half of the season much less onerous.
they still got 47 points in that season, somehow!!
I think thats a refreshing and interesting posting.
I would suggest that is quite a serious charge levelled at Mr Curbishley that he neglected to look beyond his likely time at the club.
If true he has more to answer for than Mr Murray and Mr Dowie imho as in that scenario he clearly left the club high and dry.
Yes, OAM, that is quite true and please believe me - I am second to no man in my love and admiration for Curbs and what he did for our club.
But when you look back on that 2005/06 season you can see quite clearly that we won 6 from our first 9 games and then only won another 8 from the remaining 29 games (and lost 16 of them) which is veering toward relegation form whichever way you look at it.
Moreover, you could already see the weaknesses emerging in our post-Parker midfield with the 5-2 debacle at The Valley against Man City as well as the Carling Cup loss to Blackburn when were 2-0 up and lost 3-2 - but we did nothing to address that weakness.
The decline was there for all to see from having Dean Kiely as keeper we suddenly had the untried Stephen Andersen and past it Tommy Myhre. From having Rufus/Fish/Costa as our centre-halves we suddenly had El Karkouri/Sorondo/Perry. In midfield we went from quality like Parker/Jensen (both of whom left us for Premiership clubs) to Hughes/Holland/Kishishev (none of whom would have had a prayer of playing for another Premiership club). The only exception to the rule was the front two where the Bent-Bent combination should have been, on paper at least, the best pairing we ever had in the Premiership.
So, sorry to have to disagree, but Curbs has to have his share of the blame for not maintaining a better quality squad in those final years and making too many bad buys (Jeffers, Rommedhal, El Karkouri, Hughes, M. Bent etc) and too few good ones apart from the excellent D. Bent.