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Facial Recognition Technology at the Valley?

shirty5
shirty5 Posts: 19,231
in General Charlton

https://www.castrust.org/2025/06/facial-recognition-technology/


CAST has today written to CAFC on the subject of facial recognition technology. We wrote:

"Supporters across England and Wales are becoming increasingly concerned that facial recognition is being installed at stadium turnstiles without proper consultation with fans and consideration of the data use and privacy issues.
Technology is in place at the Etihad, Bet 365 and MKM stadiums, Turf Moor, and Portman Road There are now reports of it having been introduced at Hillsborough.

CAST's view is that Charlton fans have significant confidence in the club's safety leadership team. However, fans may still worry that such technology could be installed at The Valley. Therefore, we'd like to ask the club to proactively tell fans in a statement that there are no plans to introduce facial recognition technology at The Valley

As you know, CAST is affiliated to the FSA. At the recent AGM in Manchester a motion was passed to enable a policy that commits the FSA to oppose the adoption of the technology until “transparent and meaningful dialogue has taken place at a national level with fans, leagues, the FA, civil rights groups and the Information Commissioner’s Office on its legality and privacy concerns.”

We think there is an opportunity for Charlton to be seen to leading on this matter by being proactive in communication"

yours etc

The CAST Board

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Comments

  • OhMyGodden
    OhMyGodden Posts: 247
    So the CAST want to help fan disorder? Trying to press their own views onto everyone, they don't speak for me.
  • msomerton
    msomerton Posts: 2,972
    Sorry Cast it does not bother me. I can care less. 
  • Dave2l
    Dave2l Posts: 8,866
    People within football hierarchy always feel a need to change things.

    Change things that aren't very important or necessary.

    Football can stand on its own two feet and it doesn't need any help.

    How about just leave it.the way it is 

  • ElfsborgAddick
    ElfsborgAddick Posts: 29,044
    Facial recognition here in Brazil is an everyday thing.
    Example, assuming you have a mobile.  Two weeks ago I wanted to go to exactly the same situation, a football match.
    I registered to be a member, through the process they asked to take a photo(following the steps was easy).
    My application was accepted.
    I ordered a ticket and paid, all in 10 minutes.
    My basket said I bought a ticket.
    Admittedly I went to the ground early and they confirmed all was good, so next time I'll go 5 minutes before kick-off!
    A major problem is this system naturally deters people only looking to go once in a while.

  • Off_it
    Off_it Posts: 28,848
    ElfsborgAddick said:
    Facial recognition here in Brazil is an everyday thing.
    Example, assuming you have a mobile.  Two weeks ago I wanted to go to exactly the same situation, a football match.
    I registered to be a member, through the process they asked to take a photo(following the steps was easy).
    My application was accepted.
    I ordered a ticket and paid, all in 10 minutes.
    My basket said I bought a ticket.
    Admittedly I went to the ground early and they confirmed all was good, so next time I'll go 5 minutes before kick-off!
    A major problem is this system naturally deters people only looking to go once in a while.

    So, that system you describe, how is it an improvement on the system we've got now, where you can pay and receive your ticket online and get into a game in exactly the same way?
  • ElfsborgAddick
    ElfsborgAddick Posts: 29,044
    Off_it said:
    ElfsborgAddick said:
    Facial recognition here in Brazil is an everyday thing.
    Example, assuming you have a mobile.  Two weeks ago I wanted to go to exactly the same situation, a football match.
    I registered to be a member, through the process they asked to take a photo(following the steps was easy).
    My application was accepted.
    I ordered a ticket and paid, all in 10 minutes.
    My basket said I bought a ticket.
    Admittedly I went to the ground early and they confirmed all was good, so next time I'll go 5 minutes before kick-off!
    A major problem is this system naturally deters people only looking to go once in a while.

    So, that system you describe, how is it an improvement on the system we've got now, where you can pay and receive your ticket online and get into a game in exactly the same way?
    On a football front, not at all, a total pain in the backside.
    I saw Palmeiras v Cruzeiro around September 2023 and it was 5k short of capacity.  On the day sales was virtually non existent.
  • Siv_in_Norfolk
    Siv_in_Norfolk Posts: 4,057
    Yeah... what's missing from the thread - and CAST's statement - are reasons to install/not install
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  • charlton4ever
    charlton4ever Posts: 1,716
    edited July 1
    Who pays for it ? 
  • JustFloydRoad
    JustFloydRoad Posts: 1,620
    shirty5 said:

    https://www.castrust.org/2025/06/facial-recognition-technology/


    CAST has today written to CAFC on the subject of facial recognition technology. We wrote:

    "Supporters across England and Wales are becoming increasingly concerned that facial recognition is being installed at stadium turnstiles without proper consultation with fans and consideration of the data use and privacy issues.
    Technology is in place at the Etihad, Bet 365 and MKM stadiums, Turf Moor, and Portman Road There are now reports of it having been introduced at Hillsborough.

    Wait Hillsborough? So they can afford to install facial recognition technology but not pay players and staff?!
  • shirty5
    shirty5 Posts: 19,231
    blackpool72 said:
    As a season ticket holder whenever I can't attend a home match I always try and give my season ticket to someone to use.
    I know this is against the rules but it's something I do.
    Facial recognition would probably put paid to that.
    So it's a no from me.
    https://www.etsy.com/uk/listing/1886856076/personalised-groom-face-masks-hen-party?ls=a&external=1&ref=pla_similar_listing_top-1&frs=1&sts=1&plkey=dd86a2053cd216b11753b64a2ff87794846f0866%3A1886856076
  • MrOneLung
    MrOneLung Posts: 26,856
    Hold on, has it been said that the club are thinking of bringing this in ? Or is the just a pre-emptive shot across the clubs bows ?
  • Henry Irving
    Henry Irving Posts: 85,225
    sammy391 said:
    Rightly or wrongly, facial recognition would put a total stop to family/friends using ST's when paying user cant attend.
    It could also mean that fans are forced to have their image on file/data.

    absolutely no need for it, especially if there is no fan consultation. 
    Clubs already have great stadium CCTV to pick out fans, at the turnstiles would be totally OTT
    And this is the reason it is being used or is planned at a number of EPL clubs, nothing to do with disorder.

    I doubt Charlton need it, want it or can afford it (as in it wouldn't be a priority not that we're skint
    @valleynick66 ).

    I suspect CAST already know the answer from the club having already asked it privately.


  • killerandflash
    killerandflash Posts: 69,849
    I have no problem if it's used to stop people with a football banning order entering.

    If it's used to stop sharing of STs, then that's a different matter. 
  • JohnnyH2
    JohnnyH2 Posts: 5,342
    As @killerandflash says if it is to stop banned people getting in I have no problem with that, perhaps CAST feel differently 
  • valleynick66
    valleynick66 Posts: 4,890
    Henry Irving said:
    sammy391 said:
    Rightly or wrongly, facial recognition would put a total stop to family/friends using ST's when paying user cant attend.
    It could also mean that fans are forced to have their image on file/data.

    absolutely no need for it, especially if there is no fan consultation. 
    Clubs already have great stadium CCTV to pick out fans, at the turnstiles would be totally OTT
    And this is the reason it is being used or is planned at a number of EPL clubs, nothing to do with disorder.

    I doubt Charlton need it, want it or can afford it (as in it wouldn't be a priority not that we're skint
    @valleynick66 ).

    I suspect CAST already know the answer from the club having already asked it privately.


    My comments on squad investment are a completely independent topic. 

    With no prior knowledge of this topic I think it’s a stretch to worry that too many tickets are being shared to an extent where the revenue is an issue and the main motivation for clubs. 

    My thoughts would be if you do nothing wrong (and I don’t mean sharing a ticket). you have no reason to be concerned. 

    Morrisons didn’t consult me either before adopting  it where I sometimes shop. 
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  • AFKABartram
    AFKABartram Posts: 57,825
    JohnnyH2 said:
    As @killerandflash says if it is to stop banned people getting in I have no problem with that, perhaps CAST feel differently 
    Or people on government watch lists / terrorism concerns 
  • charltonkeston
    charltonkeston Posts: 7,365
    There's always a negative side to things. I actually like the idea of facial recognition if used to weed out the people who don't want behave. But I would have a different opinion if the club used the data for marketing or shared it with a third party.
  • ShootersHillGuru
    ShootersHillGuru Posts: 50,619
    Forgetting Charlton and even football for a minute, I suspect that this is going to be a discussion for society in general over the very near future. Facial recognition technology is with us already and there will be pressure from the police, security services and others to have it practically everywhere. The UK is already the most surveilled society on the planet and I don’t see any reason why the government won’t want to see it rolled out and eventually replace all cctv installations. I have no knowledge but I’m willing to bet it’s already at all airports, main railway stations and other strategic locations. I’m sure someone here will have better insight than me.
  • fenaddick
    fenaddick Posts: 11,055
    Isn’t the reason for the letter explained in the letter? A motion was passed at the FSA AGM and other clubs are installing it on the sly so what’s the harm in checking? 
  • valleynick66
    valleynick66 Posts: 4,890
    Funnily CAST wouldn’t engage with the club over their statement on possible plans to close the JS stand because there was no formal proposal to comment on. 

    But what seems to be a non Charlton issue is worthy of action. 
  • soapboxsam
    soapboxsam Posts: 23,229
    AFKABartram said:
    So CAST have written to the club to oppose something that no indication has been given that it’s even under consideration at The Valley? 

    I don’t get it

    CAST are trying to be pro-active and not re-active and big brother already knows your inside leg measurement; small apparently 🧐
  • Stu_of_Kunming
    Stu_of_Kunming Posts: 17,118
    ShootersHillGuru said:
    Forgetting Charlton and even football for a minute, I suspect that this is going to be a discussion for society in general over the very near future. Facial recognition technology is with us already and there will be pressure from the police, security services and others to have it practically everywhere. The UK is already the most surveilled society on the planet and I don’t see any reason why the government won’t want to see it rolled out and eventually replace all cctv installations. I have no knowledge but I’m willing to bet it’s already at all airports, main railway stations and other strategic locations. I’m sure someone here will have better insight than me.
    A walk down literally any road, back ally, country lane here, would suggest not. I'm also not sure why anyone who isn't breaking the law would oppose it.
  • fenaddick
    fenaddick Posts: 11,055
    Stu_of_Kunming said:
    ShootersHillGuru said:
    Forgetting Charlton and even football for a minute, I suspect that this is going to be a discussion for society in general over the very near future. Facial recognition technology is with us already and there will be pressure from the police, security services and others to have it practically everywhere. The UK is already the most surveilled society on the planet and I don’t see any reason why the government won’t want to see it rolled out and eventually replace all cctv installations. I have no knowledge but I’m willing to bet it’s already at all airports, main railway stations and other strategic locations. I’m sure someone here will have better insight than me.
    A walk down literally any road, back ally, country lane here, would suggest not. I'm also not sure why anyone who isn't breaking the law would oppose it.
    Precisely because I haven't broken the law and so do not need to have my specific movements checked up on. It's a mega step up from CCTV that is only happening in football grounds because of outdated stereotypes about football fans.
  • fenaddick
    fenaddick Posts: 11,055
    Here is the FSA's view for those interested

    https://thefsa.org.uk/news/facial-recognition-turnstiles-why-supporters-should-be-concerned/
  • Steven81
    Steven81 Posts: 999
    Will it still work if I decide to wear make up on weekday matches ? 

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