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NEW ARTICLE: Another article about Slade

Yes, I know but....

When he was appointed there were, as you would expect from a forum with close to 20,000 members, a range of views on Russell Slade's suitability for the Charlton manager's job.

Most were pleased that while he wasn't the most successful manager he had managed at our newly acquired lower league status.

He is also English and again many welcomed this, not in a xenophobic way because most would have taken Pep or Jose or even Sir Alex, but because it was a sign that we might be a more "normal" club again with a manager familiar with the ways of English football; the grounds, the tactics, the opposition, the media, the agents, etc.

Many pointed out, however, that his record was less than impressive having never won promotion despite twice going close. Yet, others argued, given these near misses were with "small" clubs, Yeovil and Orient, relatively it was still an achievement to have even done that well.

And maybe that is the problem.

Slade did well at "small" clubs where expectations were low, where any success was hailed as a great achievement. Small clubs with small squads were he could create a tight knit group of players and fans. And as "small" clubs it was permissible to play more defensively, to hold the big boys and maybe even sneak a win. The big clubs felt that they should be beating the likes of Orient and Yeovil and attacked them, suiting the more defensive minded Slade. And that also fed in to the David and Goliath mindset for Slade and his players perhaps? It became a virtuous cycle and fed that self-confidence and team ethic.

But this is Charlton and while we deserve to be in league 1 on merit just as do all the other 23 sides in the division we're not Orient or Yeovil. And perhaps that is the problem for Slade.

The expectation from fans, from the board and yes from players too is that we are a top six side. That might be unrealistic but never the less it is the expectation. We don't want a top six place, we demand it, financially the board desperately need it and many of the players were signed on the understanding that this was a bigger club than 18th in league 1. The likes of Ajose, Novak, Pearce and Magennis must have been told or at least assumed that they were joining a promotion chasing side. Lookman and Fox had offers to go but stayed but I doubt that they thought it meant being in a relegation fight.

Slade's sides have struggled so far, that is obvious. There will be as many reasons for that as members of Charlton Life. Fitness, late arrival of players and a poor pre-season, poor and/or interfered with recruitment, lack of funds due to paying wages of on loan or out of favour players, Slade's tactics, formations and subs and even for the weird few, the protests that haven't actually taken place.

But what is clear is that, so far, it ain't working.

I suspect that he isn't the right manager for where we are now. We see this all the time. Rochdale manager Keith Hill has worked wonders at Spotland, the epitome of a small club but he didn't do it at Barnsley and soon returned to the Dale to carry on his success.

Slade hasn't built a tight knit squad, a "all for one, one for all, lets show those big boys what we're made of" type of team that is more than the sum of its parts. He can't because at this level it's not in the nature of the club. His style isn't working and unless he changes his and others mindsets I don't think it ever will.

Not that getting rid of Slade would change the underlying problems at the club, which remain in the boardroom and in Belgium, but neither do I think he'll make the most of the poor hand he's been dealt.

The alternatives are less than attractive. Nobby Vinegar, Chris O'Loughin from the network. Steve Evens for a shouty Brit with a track record. Or an in-house appointment of Jackson and Clarke to try and appease the fans. The last might just work short term but would soon be undermined by the regime and I would hate to be writing a similar piece about the skipper turned boss in a few months.

Where do we go from here? I don't know but to revive a meme I've used before it is going to be a bumpy ride.







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Comments

  • Lennie Lawrence anyone, now he's been released by Cardiff? I'm never quite sure if he's still popular here on CL or amongst the general fan base.
  • Lennie Lawrence anyone, now he's been released by Cardiff? I'm never quite sure if he's still popular here on CL or amongst the general fan base.

    My only worry though is he's not been an actual Manager for 11-years now.

    Its like calling for Glenn Hoddle to be hired as England Manager again... Yes the difference is that Lennie has remained in Football since he was last a Manager (whereas Hoddle has mainly been a useless pundit) but so much has changed in Football since he was last in charge (i.e. Agents / Wages / Transfer Fees etc.)
  • edited October 2016
    Apart from the general pre-season debâcle, I wonder if Brussel pinned too many hopes on signing Thompson from Norwich or, at least, another attacking midfielder. All the comments on here suggest a sluggish, easily over-run midfield and lack of service to the forwards.

    It's early days: a couple of wins would see us back in the top 8, although it's hard to see where those wins are going to come from at the moment. Again from the comments here it seems like Slade might have begun to lose (or already lost) the dressing room, in which case it's lost cause. If not, the midfield seriously needs an injection in the transfer window (Katie's Christmas holiday plans & Roland's purse strings permitting: and even then, who'd want to come and play here?)

    In a sense changing the manager wouldn't help because of the endemic problems at the club. Nothing's going to change until Meire and the rest are gone, and we'd likely as not just get the darling of T20K, José Riga, back again. But Slade seems to be ever more part of the regime, and I think he has far less autonomy and say in the general running of the team than he & Latrine frequently try and have us believe.

  • There's no shortage of candidates out there, of varying degrees of attractiveness. Jackett and Friedman come to mind.

    Yes, we are a basket case of a club, but managers need work. Stay out of the game for too long, and you risk being forgotten about. And if you fail at The Valley, due to the problems behind the scenes, you have a get out clause...
  • edited October 2016

    There's no shortage of candidates out there, of varying degrees of attractiveness. Jackett and Friedman come to mind.

    Yes, we are a basket case of a club, but managers need work. Stay out of the game for too long, and you risk being forgotten about. And if you fail at The Valley, due to the problems behind the scenes, you have a get out clause...

    I take your point but it's kind of sad that managers would look to us primarily as a stop gap in their career and a pay off if it doesn't (inevitably) work, rather than coming here actually believing they can take the club somewhere (impossible with this lot in charge).

    Whilst Friedman's used to working with crackpot owners, he and Jackett are both tarred with the Palace/Millwall brush, although Jackett's record is pretty good - far better than Slade at any rate.
  • Good article regarding Crawley Town Manager.


    The man who brought through players like Ruben Loftus-Cheek, Lewis Baker, Dominic Solanke and Andreas Christensen at Chelsea as Under-21 boss, and while youth coach at Arsenal helped develop both Jack Wilshere and Kieron Gibbs, still hopes that some of his youngsters can finally get a break at Stamford Bridge.

    But now his focus is on League Two club Crawley. He clinched the job this summer by showing the new owner, Turkish steel magnate Ziya Eren, a video presentation of his plans - which began with a clip from 'Only Fools And Horses'.

    "I put that in there just to relax them and start with a laugh," said the 55-year-old. "Fortunately Ziya loved it - but he loved the plans for the club even better."

    So the journey, from Arsenal to Chelsea and via Brazil and the Nags Head in Peckham, has brought him to Crawley - some fare for the former Arsenal youngster who worked as a London cabbie while playing non-League football after being rejected at 19 by the Gunners.

    Drummy has forged a reputation as one of the best coaches around, winning the FA Youth Cup in 2010 and the Under-21 Premier League in 2014 with Chelsea.

    Currently Chelsea have a staggering 38 players out on loan, many of them the youngsters Drummy worked with. Among them is striker Tammy Abraham, who has scored 11 goals in 14 games at Bristol City.

    Despite all the millions spent, the last home-grown kid to break through at Stamford Bridge and establish a place in the first team was John Terry.

    Drummy believes that until the club have a settled policy under a manager who stays for more than the two-year maximum apparently favoured by Roman Abramovich, that pattern will not change.

    "Chelsea have produced plenty of players up to about the Under-20 level, but then what happens? They go out on loan," said Drummy. "It's messy. There is no real link to the first team.

    "I don't think Chelsea's managers know enough about these young players. Antonio Conte or any manager that comes in has to hit the ground running fast. You lose a game and it is alarm bells. Their remit is to keep their jobs, be successful with the first team.

    Young players don't always instantly succeed. Lewis Baker [on loan at Vitesse Arnhem] is a very good player. I said to Jose Mourinho, 'You will need to tell him he's good'. Does the manager have time for that?

    "What is the strategy at Chelsea? Is it season to season? They can't look at their best youngster, say Charly Musonda [on loan at Real Betis], and plot where he is going to be in three years' time. Because who will the manager be then? So they can't actually say that Charly will be one for then.

    "The philosophy changes all the time. It will be whatever Conte's is, whatever Jose's is. The instability is very tough on young players.

    "But then again, do Chelsea need that, with the buying power they have? No. The buying power can paper over these things."

    Drummy, who almost joined Brazilian club Bangu after leaving Chelsea, has raided his old club to get two youngsters on loan, and has another four former Stamford Bridge men on his books, keen to link again with their old mentor.

    Saturday's timely 1-0 win over Blackpool has raised Crawley to fifth place. Drummy's target is stability, and if possible the play-offs.

    "Coming on loan to clubs like this is good for these players. This is the real world. It is three points, and you do it, or you are out," he said.

    "I am trying to get the same ethic here as there is at Chelsea, but it takes time. It is difficult in the physicality of League Two.

    "I have got a grounding that can help these players. I didn't make it as a player at Arsenal. I went non-League, drove a cab, got in at four in the morning and then went coaching. My journey has been different. But it means I can talk to these lads.

    "I learned from Liam Brady at Arsenal - don't get carried away, believe in what you are doing." As Del Boy once said, of course.
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  • WSS said:

    Not worth a promote

    Got a sticky though
  • I am beginning to think that "Nobby Vinegar" is not a made up name - I laughed the first few times, now I'm worried we're talking about appointing a condiment!
  • Maybe time to forget about the colour of the deckchair when the ship is sinking .
  • good article I hope you are wrong about Slade but you could be right in which case we're not getting promoted any time soon
  • Where's the link to an article? I feel duped
  • Fumbluff said:

    I feel duped

    Average Charlton supporter then?
  • Lennie Lawrence anyone, now he's been released by Cardiff? I'm never quite sure if he's still popular here on CL or amongst the general fan base.

    Sir Lennie needs to stay a million miles away from here to keep his legendary staus.
  • edited October 2016
    Saga Lout said:

    I am beginning to think that "Nobby Vinegar" is not a made up name - I laughed the first few times, now I'm worried we're talking about appointing a condiment!

    Nobby started his career as a left back for Bourneville but was snapped up by Branston for £100 and made 27 appearances before early injury forced him to retire from the game and he graduated with a 3.1 law degree from Greater Manchester University (Salford Polytechnic). After a brief but fulfilling work experience programme in Belgium he met and fell in love with a young, talented lawyer who promised him that failure would never be an option, the world would be his oyster, and that all he had to do was send 12 crisp packets and write an e-mail to a senile old Belgian psychopath. The rest is history (although, sadly, Nobby’s hate of Belgian house music finally led to the couple splitting up and, to Nobby’s chagrin, and by a cruel twist of fate, the young lawyer became president of the EFL and right arm woman to Sir Alan Sugar).
  • Why is this a sticky thread? It's an opinion of the manager from a fellow fan. Nothing special here. Apart from maybe some special treatment.
  • edited October 2016
    Good article and last night watching that dross I was honestly thinking exactly the same.

    Slade has always been in charge of "underdogs" so sets his teams up negatively, to try & "steal" something.

    "Where do we go from here ? "

    Well if Slade gets the bullet, I don't care, because it's already apparent the players aren't playing for him, as we're outbattled far too often. But if he goes, who will replace him ? Kenny Jackett would be a good candidate.

    If he stays he needs to drop the players that are virtually every single game our worst players.

    So you drop Foley (from centre mid, not right back), Crofts, Jackson, Fox, Ajose (possibly) and Novak definitely.

    You then select from what you have & at the very least you should have a team of triers and with the ability to run around & compete.

    Kishishev wasn't the greatest midfielder, but by God he would chase and chase all day long.

    Suggestion for an X1 with no crocks in midfield, who should all be able & willing to give 100%, without giving the oppo a goal or two.

    Rudd

    Solly Bauer Pearce Chicksen

    Botaka Ulvestad Aribo Holmes

    Magennis Hanlan

    Subs Lookman, Foley, Jackson, Johnson, Ajose, Phillips

    Holmes or someone other than Lookman to take corners and attack on the floor.
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  • Good article and last night watching that dross I honestly was thinking exactly the same.

    Slade has always been in charge of "underdogs" so sets his teams up negatively, to try & "steal" something.

    "where do we go from here ? "

    Well if Slade gets the bullet, I don't care, because it's already apparent the players aren't playing for him, as we're outbattled far too often. But if he goes, who will replace him. Kenny Jackett would be a good candidate.

    If he stays he needs to drop the players that are virtually every single game our worst players.

    So you drop Foley (from centre mid, not right back), Crofts, Fox, Ajose (possibly) and Novak definitely.

    You then select from what you have & at the very least you should have a team of triers and with the ability to run around & compete.

    Kishishev wasn't the greatest midfielder, but by God he would chase and chase all day long.

    Suggestion for an X1 with no crocks in midfield, who should all be able & willing to give 100%, without giving the oppo a goal or two.

    Rudd

    Solly Bauer Pearce Chicksen

    Botaka Ulvestad Aribo Holmes

    Magennis Hanlan

    Subs Lookman, Foley, Jackson, Johnson, Ajose, Phillips

    Holmes or someone other than Lookman to take corners and attack on the floor.

    Interesting squad, certainly worth a go although I wouldn't have Johnson on the bench (because he's not good enough)
  • Johnson & Holmes were out best players last night by a long chalk.
  • Johnson & Holmes were out best players last night by a long chalk.

    Fair enough
  • Roger's had a decent rest bless him.
  • I think the side that played the last few matches in the Championship would, had they been kept together, fairly comfortably have won promotion back from League One, even with or without Riga in charge.
    I always felt that going down the 'lower league manager', and 'decent division one players' route might mean you end up with an average mid table League One side. Maybe we should have tried harder to hang on to our better players - although maybe they had get-out clauses in their contracts?
    Slade is way too negative. I've noticed a few times that when we've had throw-ins in the opposition half, there's only been two or three players over the half way line. We lose the ball. What a surprise.
  • Have we not all learned by now that it doesn't matter who the players are and it doesn't matter who the manager/ head coach is - under the Roland /Katrien combo there is only one way we are going, and that's down.
  • Down down, deeper and down.
  • Have we not all learned by now that it doesn't matter who the players are and it doesn't matter who the manager/ head coach is - under the Roland /Katrien combo there is only one way we are going, and that's down.

    So true my friend.

    its not the captain of the boat that is at fault but the Owner of the said boat.
  • Why is this a sticky thread? It's an opinion of the manager from a fellow fan. Nothing special here. Apart from maybe some special treatment.

    It's not who you know, it's the quality of the wool you wear :smile:
  • Slade took Cardiff to 8th in the Championship last season. A club with similar fan base to ours, difficult foreign owners, recent Premier League experience (much more recent than ours), and parachute payments.

    They weren't particular underdogs and there will have been expectation there from the stands and the boardroom.

    Not saying 8th is a fantastic achievement but it's a lot better than 19th, so while there may be something in the idea that Slade does his best work at smaller clubs, I don't think that alone can explain why we have started quite so poorly under him.
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Roland Out!