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++Charlie Kelman signs on a 4 year deal++
Comments
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Godden played 7,057 minutes in the championship with Coventry and scored 32 goals. That’s a goal every 220 minutes. Averages at 18 goals in 46 games. Theres definitely a place for a striker play style like Godden issue is Kelman is so far off replicating Godden’s qualitiesForeverAddickted said:fenaddick said:Yeah the May comparison is Godden and Kelman is meant to be a replacement/style development on Godden which hasn’t yet happenedI dunno... Godden only got six in his first Championship season...Im still loath to acknowledge his time at this level with QPR, as they were similar to early Karlan Grant minutes for us3 -
Dare I say he’s seems a little ‘nice’, a lot of the successful smaller strikers have a bit of the devil in them and put themselves about a bit, not really seen much of that, just the once when he got the shot off before the JRC goal. Seems to have lost sharpness if that’s possible at this stage of the season.1
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If we stay up, I very much doubt he'll be with us next season.
I get the feeling NJ has made his mind up about him.
Think his lack of physicality grates with the the boss.1 -
Whether he’s here or not depends on if/what offers we receive for him. If we were offered what we paid for him or close to that we likely snap that up but if we don’t I’d guess we’d be willing to play the long waiting gamemid_life_crisis said:If we stay up, I very much doubt he'll be with us next season.
I get the feeling NJ has made his mind up about him.
Think his lack of physicality grates with the the boss.0 -
At the moment his value has most definitely decreased, keep our powder dry on this I’d say.Crispywood said:
Whether he’s here or not depends on if/what offers we receive for him. If we were offered what we paid for him or close to that we likely snap that up but if we don’t I’d guess we’d be willing to play the long waiting gamemid_life_crisis said:If we stay up, I very much doubt he'll be with us next season.
I get the feeling NJ has made his mind up about him.
Think his lack of physicality grates with the the boss.0 -
See where we are in the summer, but think Charlie still has the potential to be a really important player for us
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A lot of the development I think he needs is more physical than technical. Had a disrupted pre-season this season so I think we may see a big difference next season if he puts the work in this summer2
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It's not the lack of goals that worries me. His goal v Oxford was the best striker's finish this season. It's how anonymous he is, that concerns me. Seems to get five touches a half, most of them innocuous. A lot of fans are being very generous with their appraisals of him and finding excuses to be patient with him. I think he's had a lot of game time and in that time shown next to nothing. I don't think he's a serious options for an established Championship team which is where we want to be heading next season, so I'm happy for us to sell him to an ambitious L1 team in the summer and look forward. Most our players can be improved upon and he's the most obvious case in point.2
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We are wasting our time with him. There is no real desire or fight. His backing out of a chance to score yesterday was unforgivable2
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Happy to be corrected if there’s a video that shows I am misremembering. Going on my view from the away end, he was wide on the left with one defender clearly covering his approach to goal. He slowed slightly and looked up to see that there was no other supporting player moving at pace to support him. Fairly quickly there were at least two additional covering players and the chance to head for goal had gone. He then played the ball backwards. It’s being presented on here almost as a one on one. He could’ve pressed on but the position clearly wasn’t as good as the one that led to his shot and JRC’s goal against Coventry. Really can’t see why he is getting so much flak on this one.7
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Less match time than say TC, more goals than TC. Let’s sell TC to an ambitious League One team instead? Or, we be patient with both. Both are young, both are still learning, both are new to the Championship, relatively speaking. You say people find excuses to be patient with Kelman but even more so with TC because he’s one of our own. When Charlie’s had a chance, in the box, he’s been clinical. Problem is we don’t create enough chances for him. That isn’t his fault.Making_all_the_noise said:It's not the lack of goals that worries me. His goal v Oxford was the best striker's finish this season. It's how anonymous he is, that concerns me. Seems to get five touches a half, most of them innocuous. A lot of fans are being very generous with their appraisals of him and finding excuses to be patient with him. I think he's had a lot of game time and in that time shown next to nothing. I don't think he's a serious options for an established Championship team which is where we want to be heading next season, so I'm happy for us to sell him to an ambitious L1 team in the summer and look forward. Most our players can be improved upon and he's the most obvious case in point.2 -
Two very good finishes (Swansea and Oxford), plus a tap in and penalty against Blackburn aren't great returns, when his overall impact on games hasn't been great, with zero assists for example, and indeed zero big chances created.Making_all_the_noise said:It's not the lack of goals that worries me. His goal v Oxford was the best striker's finish this season. It's how anonymous he is, that concerns me. Seems to get five touches a half, most of them innocuous. A lot of fans are being very generous with their appraisals of him and finding excuses to be patient with him. I think he's had a lot of game time and in that time shown next to nothing. I don't think he's a serious options for an established Championship team which is where we want to be heading next season, so I'm happy for us to sell him to an ambitious L1 team in the summer and look forward. Most our players can be improved upon and he's the most obvious case in point.
That we've even considered signing Michail Antonio says it all, as Jones wouldn't be playing Antonio alongside Kelman, that's not how this team is built.
Kelman is a very good finisher when he gets a chance, but feels a luxury at this level, as opposed to an attacking L1 side winning lots of games and creating lots of chances. And strikers of course have to have the right movement to sniff out those chances, as the higher you so, the stronger and faster opposition defenders are.
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I really hope you are right Shooters but I fear more if the same but with more Champ quality and experience. Just cannot see us being expansive and fluid under N Jones - but I do hope you are right mateShootersHillGuru said:
I think next season our style of play will change dramatically. We set up to stifle teams and the expansive side suffers. I don’t think we can rely on that for another season. Jones will I’m sure want to be more fluid and I think Charlie Kelman will be one of the biggest beneficiaries.fenaddick said:For me it’s fairly clear that we didn’t think we could afford a striker in the NJ style and so bought two hoping to train at least one of them into that striker. It hasn’t worked, yet. I’m not writing him off yet, I hope having a pre season will help us get the best of him0 -
TC has played much of the season at left wing back.LargeAddick said:
Less match time than say TC, more goals than TC. Let’s sell TC to an ambitious League One team instead? Or, we be patient with both. Both are young, both are still learning, both are new to the Championship, relatively speaking. You say people find excuses to be patient with Kelman but even more so with TC because he’s one of our own. When Charlie’s had a chance, in the box, he’s been clinical. Problem is we don’t create enough chances for him. That isn’t his fault.Making_all_the_noise said:It's not the lack of goals that worries me. His goal v Oxford was the best striker's finish this season. It's how anonymous he is, that concerns me. Seems to get five touches a half, most of them innocuous. A lot of fans are being very generous with their appraisals of him and finding excuses to be patient with him. I think he's had a lot of game time and in that time shown next to nothing. I don't think he's a serious options for an established Championship team which is where we want to be heading next season, so I'm happy for us to sell him to an ambitious L1 team in the summer and look forward. Most our players can be improved upon and he's the most obvious case in point.
And TC, for all his faults, does cause opposition defenders problems. Often you see them doubling up on him. TC's dribbles move us up the park, create space and win free kicks.
TC and Miles are way ahead of Kelman when it comes to fouls won.
https://betting.betfair.com/football/stats/player-fouls-won/
He could have continued into the corner, to "do a Tony Watt" or earn a throw in their half. He could have tried to go round the defender, or shielded the ball to try and win a free kick.JohnnyJoeyDeeDee said:Happy to be corrected if there’s a video that shows I am misremembering. Going on my view from the away end, he was wide on the left with one defender clearly covering his approach to goal. He slowed slightly and looked up to see that there was no other supporting player moving at pace to support him. Fairly quickly there were at least two additional covering players and the chance to head for goal had gone. He then played the ball backwards. It’s being presented on here almost as a one on one. He could’ve pressed on but the position clearly wasn’t as good as the one that led to his shot and JRC’s goal against Coventry. Really can’t see why he is getting so much flak on this one.
Nobody is saying that they expected him to run through and score a famous winner, but he could have done a lot more to eat up some time.3 -
I think he is still smarting from the bollocking he got at Blackburn, where he lost it in the corner when isolated and no one got up, and they countered and scored.killerandflash said:
TC has played much of the season at left wing back.LargeAddick said:
Less match time than say TC, more goals than TC. Let’s sell TC to an ambitious League One team instead? Or, we be patient with both. Both are young, both are still learning, both are new to the Championship, relatively speaking. You say people find excuses to be patient with Kelman but even more so with TC because he’s one of our own. When Charlie’s had a chance, in the box, he’s been clinical. Problem is we don’t create enough chances for him. That isn’t his fault.Making_all_the_noise said:It's not the lack of goals that worries me. His goal v Oxford was the best striker's finish this season. It's how anonymous he is, that concerns me. Seems to get five touches a half, most of them innocuous. A lot of fans are being very generous with their appraisals of him and finding excuses to be patient with him. I think he's had a lot of game time and in that time shown next to nothing. I don't think he's a serious options for an established Championship team which is where we want to be heading next season, so I'm happy for us to sell him to an ambitious L1 team in the summer and look forward. Most our players can be improved upon and he's the most obvious case in point.
And TC, for all his faults, does cause opposition defenders problems. Often you see them doubling up on him. TC's dribbles move us up the park, create space and win free kicks.
TC and Miles are way ahead of Kelman when it comes to fouls won.
https://betting.betfair.com/football/stats/player-fouls-won/
He could have continued into the corner, to "do a Tony Watt" or earn a throw in their half. He could have tried to go round the defender, or shielded the ball to try and win a free kick.JohnnyJoeyDeeDee said:Happy to be corrected if there’s a video that shows I am misremembering. Going on my view from the away end, he was wide on the left with one defender clearly covering his approach to goal. He slowed slightly and looked up to see that there was no other supporting player moving at pace to support him. Fairly quickly there were at least two additional covering players and the chance to head for goal had gone. He then played the ball backwards. It’s being presented on here almost as a one on one. He could’ve pressed on but the position clearly wasn’t as good as the one that led to his shot and JRC’s goal against Coventry. Really can’t see why he is getting so much flak on this one.
Nobody is saying that they expected him to run through and score a famous winner, but he could have done a lot more to eat up some time.2 -
I feel like he needs to really get the arsehole about something to give him a shake!!, when he came back from injury he looked sharper and quicker which led us to believe the injury was holding him back, but he seems to be a bit pre injury again. I really want to see him do well and there is definitely something about him but needs to really go for it.0
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Will always be judged a lot harsher than our other forwards who have scored fewer as he cost a "big" fee.
We don't play the way that type of striker needs, plenty have said it already, yes it's worked for NJ with Godden but comparing those two is unfair given they're at opposite ends of their respective careers. NJ would like a kelman in a few seasons time when he's developed a more rounded game and is more Godden than he is now, but won't have the patience to do that himself, other players he's brought on since his arrival have had the hard skills in place already (TC - pace/ Leaburn -height/size) to play how NJ wants.
He won't be with us next season wherever we play (the champ) Shame, but thaaaaaats NJ football.2 -
When we signed Kelman I thought I'd have preferred Kone.
Kone has more strength and would contribute more and I think he's a better goal scorer.
I've kept out of the discussions hoping Kelman would improve, but I've seen nothing to suggest he has.5 -
Neither have impressed really. The two ex L1 strikers to impress in the Championship this season scored 7 & 11 L1 goals last season for Lincoln and Burton. Shows that the attributes needed to succeed in a mid table L1 side are probably more transferrable than a top end L1 sideCovered End said:When we signed Kelman I thought I'd have preferred Kone.
Kone has more strength and would contribute more and I think he's a better goal scorer.
I've kept out of the discussions hoping Kelman would improve, but I've seen nothing to suggest he has.1 -
Every now and then we spend money on strikers that just aren’t up to it, look at the dross we signed post prem relegation Varney, Iwelumo and that fella from Burnley who’s name escapes me, Ajose there’s probably more
He looks a bit overweight uninterested, lazy and not buying into the system and even if the system isn’t great and he might fit a better one I still think he found his level last year and QPR are having a giggle at us for spending that sort of money
The boy can finish we know that but not in this team in my opinion at this level
Time will tell and I hope he proves me wrong and bangs one in tomorrow but long term I see him being ditched in the summer if we survive
If we don’t we have a hell of a league one player next season0 -
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I have my doubts he will ever prosper in a NJ team.
Had high hopes, and want to be proved wrong.1 -
I honestly think he could be gone even if we get relegated. Jones shown to prefer Leaburn + TC and then you would think Mbick + Kanu would be be given the opportunity after their successful loansSouthendaddick said:Every now and then we spend money on strikers that just aren’t up to it, look at the dross we signed post prem relegation Varney, Iwelumo and that fella from Burnley who’s name escapes me, Ajose there’s probably more
He looks a bit overweight uninterested, lazy and not buying into the system and even if the system isn’t great and he might fit a better one I still think he found his level last year and QPR are having a giggle at us for spending that sort of money
The boy can finish we know that but not in this team in my opinion at this level
Time will tell and I hope he proves me wrong and bangs one in tomorrow but long term I see him being ditched in the summer if we survive
If we don’t we have a hell of a league one player next season0 -
Think we’d be very unlikely to keep TC if relegatedCrispywood said:
I honestly think he could be gone even if we get relegated. Jones shown to prefer Leaburn + TC and then you would think Mbick + Kanu would be be given the opportunity after their successful loansSouthendaddick said:Every now and then we spend money on strikers that just aren’t up to it, look at the dross we signed post prem relegation Varney, Iwelumo and that fella from Burnley who’s name escapes me, Ajose there’s probably more
He looks a bit overweight uninterested, lazy and not buying into the system and even if the system isn’t great and he might fit a better one I still think he found his level last year and QPR are having a giggle at us for spending that sort of money
The boy can finish we know that but not in this team in my opinion at this level
Time will tell and I hope he proves me wrong and bangs one in tomorrow but long term I see him being ditched in the summer if we survive
If we don’t we have a hell of a league one player next season
I still think we view Kelman as a project and he’s shown enough to not be given up on yet. We’ve bought him for the player we think we can make him rather than what he is now. I think this pre-season is key, get him stronger and fitter, learn how to battle defenders at this level and be more of a nuisance even if he’s not getting chances. Next season will be make or break1 -
Wouldn't have Kone anywhere near our squad. Attitude absolutely stinks and spends the whole game leaving sly tackles off the ball on players. Think the " challenge" on Kayne in the Playoff Semi would have been enough to put us off anyway.
Would rather persist with Kelman if it's a choice between the 2.4 -
Yeah I was more of a fan of kone but he’s fallen off massively. At the valley he looked very ordinary.2
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Kelman isn't someone who's come from abroad like Sichenje, who has to adapt to English football and this division.NabySarr said:
Think we’d be very unlikely to keep TC if relegatedCrispywood said:
I honestly think he could be gone even if we get relegated. Jones shown to prefer Leaburn + TC and then you would think Mbick + Kanu would be be given the opportunity after their successful loansSouthendaddick said:Every now and then we spend money on strikers that just aren’t up to it, look at the dross we signed post prem relegation Varney, Iwelumo and that fella from Burnley who’s name escapes me, Ajose there’s probably more
He looks a bit overweight uninterested, lazy and not buying into the system and even if the system isn’t great and he might fit a better one I still think he found his level last year and QPR are having a giggle at us for spending that sort of money
The boy can finish we know that but not in this team in my opinion at this level
Time will tell and I hope he proves me wrong and bangs one in tomorrow but long term I see him being ditched in the summer if we survive
If we don’t we have a hell of a league one player next season
I still think we view Kelman as a project and he’s shown enough to not be given up on yet. We’ve bought him for the player we think we can make him rather than what he is now. I think this pre-season is key, get him stronger and fitter, learn how to battle defenders at this level and be more of a nuisance even if he’s not getting chances. Next season will be make or break
He's someone who was at QPR for 5 seasons. Even if he had long loan spells away, he will know what's required at this level, having had several pre-seasons training with QPR, a solid Championship club. I suspect he's down on confidence at the moment, which is affecting him on the pitch, but his basic game is what it is. And NJ's football is what it is.
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I'd start him for a few games with Dykes and see how it goes. Never feel like he's going to influence the game from the bench, at least not to the extent Leaburn and Campbell can.
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As someone who likes Kelman, and the way that Jones expects his players to perform... Thats immediately not going to happen, unless he was under instructions, based off his performance from the bench on Saturday - If Godden was fit, I'd even wonder if we'd see Charlie in the team tonight.Talal said:I'd start him for a few games with Dykes and see how it goes. Never feel like he's going to influence the game from the bench, at least not to the extent Leaburn and Campbell can.0 -
Yeah I don't expect it to happen. It just feels like when he comes off the bench he never really does anything. Though happy to be corrected on that as I may have forgotten some contributions.ForeverAddickted said:
As someone who likes Kelman, and the way that Jones expects his players to perform... Thats immediately not going to happen, unless he was under instructions, based off his performance from the bench on Saturday - If Godden was fit, I'd even wonder if we'd see Charlie in the team tonight.Talal said:I'd start him for a few games with Dykes and see how it goes. Never feel like he's going to influence the game from the bench, at least not to the extent Leaburn and Campbell can.1 -
Yeah he’s not someone who is going to inject pace (TC) or power like Miles, he’s someone who you need on from the start of a half. I was always annoyed he got hooked at 60 as well, just as the game was opening up, he get taken out of it.2
