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Post-match Thread: Charlton Athletic vs Morecambe | Saturday 15th April 2022

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Comments

  • shine166
    shine166 Posts: 13,933
    Had a nice surprise in the programme yesterday, poor result but had a great day. I had no idea, until strangers in Crossbars kept asking me if i was getting married lol 


  • golfaddick
    golfaddick Posts: 33,717
    Scoham said:

    Nope, still don't understand.

    Stockley was supposed to score 1.5 goals, but only scored 1. 

    Gnahoua was only supposed to score 0.4 goals but bagged 2.


    Cheeky fellow. Wasn't supposed to be that good. 
  • Scoham
    Scoham Posts: 37,437
    Sage said:
    Scoham said:

    Same thing week in week out recently. 6 goals in the last 5 games but the expected goals would have us at around 10 or 11. We are not anywhere near ruthless enough which puts more pressure on the defence, which is poor as it is. 
    Exactly, we’re almost completely reliant on Stockley, Washington and Aneke’s goals. It makes them seem more wasteful than they really are as there’s no one we can rely on to step up when we need a goal - no defenders who are a regular threat from set pieces, no good free kick takers, no midfielders anywhere near double figures and apart from Dobson’s goal never a threat from long range.
  • Sage
    Sage Posts: 7,281
    Scoham said:
    Sage said:
    Scoham said:

    Same thing week in week out recently. 6 goals in the last 5 games but the expected goals would have us at around 10 or 11. We are not anywhere near ruthless enough which puts more pressure on the defence, which is poor as it is. 
    Exactly, we’re almost completely reliant on Stockley, Washington and Aneke’s goals. It makes them seem more wasteful than they really are as there’s no one we can rely on to step up when we need a goal - no defenders who are a regular threat from set pieces, no good free kick takers, no midfielders anywhere near double figures and apart from Dobson’s goal never a threat from long range.
    Spot on. We have no threats in terms of goals other than those 3, and to be honest they are wasteful in front of goal as well.

    Watching Wednesday smash MK, we are so far away from anything either of these two sides have it’s genuinely worrying and embarrassing.

    We need major surgery just to catch up to be anywhere near like these sides are right now.
  • cabbles
    cabbles Posts: 15,261
    SouthWest_Addicks said:
    Excellent analysis Sage. 32 players is a ridiculous number for a league 1 club. 
    Particularly when 30 of them aren’t good enough 
  • RodneyCharltonTrotta
    RodneyCharltonTrotta Posts: 14,834
    The Prince-e-Paul said:
    Stig said:
    Dazzler21 said:
    I want Albie to be a success but 6s in the ratings are madness. 

    I'm not sticking it on him though, his confidence is shot and yet we've not allowed him to play with the u23s in the time he wasn't even on the bench.

    TBH, I've given up on hopes of Albie being a success at Charlton. He's 22 years old and has had four seasons with the first team. I can't honestly say I've seen the development I'd have liked since he was a teenager. He's rapidly approaching the footballing golden-years of his mid-twenties, but he's still not reached a level where I'm comfortable seeing him regularly in our first team.

    I think he's the sort of player who could carve out a decent career in midfield for someone like Gillingham or Colchester... and then at some point he'll come back on a visit and make us look stupid for letting him go.
    Sadly 'we' are now becoming a Glingham or Colchester in the eyes of players. Not a QPR or even Millwall. So sad. 

    I thought this yesterday when i saw a dad and son in qpr shirts on their way into the ground.  As if there is now enough distance culturally and level- wise for it not to be disrespectful.  Like turning up to Welling or Bromley games in Charlton shirts.

    Even Palace and Millwall mates don't take the piss anymore as we're not relevant enough and there's no fun in mocking the afflicted.

    We're an established 3rd division club in a rented stadium now and without a remarkable summer window, which instincts tell me won't happen, we'll remain that way for the foreseable.  

    Clueless on the pitch and not seen a lot to suggest otherwise thus far off it in the past couple of years.
  • RodneyCharltonTrotta
    RodneyCharltonTrotta Posts: 14,834
    Congratulations @shine166

  • 1StevieG
    1StevieG Posts: 10,967
    Crikey. After reading @Sage post I need to cheer myself up. So much wrong with the team at the moment when there should be so much right after the 2 Shed years. I have never felt so much apathy during a game than I did yesterday. Couldn’t get excited when we got one back as I knew what was coming and like night follows day I was proved right. Can’t wait for this shambolic season come to an end. 
  • JamesSeed
    JamesSeed Posts: 17,388
    edited April 2022
    Doesn’t seem long ago we were extolling the merits of the performance against Rotherham, and the three wins in four. 
    We’ve gone from that to saying we’re now on the level of a club like Gillingham. 
    Sums up the season really. Losing streak followed by winning streak. Followed by losing streak. 
  • paulg1947
    paulg1947 Posts: 224
    eastterrace6168 said:
    Shite show in general yesterday and we got nothing, which we just about deserved...again,.. but one point regarding Mac, he is getting some serious grief regarding "that" throw, he was quick thinking in trying to get an attack started and, Matthews was just being a lazy sod, ball watching and should take all the flak, waiting for the ball rather than going to meet it, result the oppo guy waltzes up and say's cheers for the offer, result obvious,.. just my opinion...but true.. B)
     You are very correct and to only get (now2likes) shows just, like politics ,many love to jump on the populist 'band wagon' like sheep, and not delve into the bigger picture. I am no Maca fan, but you observation of Mathews sums up our season which is for 95% of the team. I hope next season ,J J only employs those who fight for the shirt

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  • MuttleyCAFC
    MuttleyCAFC Posts: 47,771
    edited April 2022
    I'm sure Jacko and his team analyse why we are conceeding goals. Now some teams will accept conceding a certain number if they are scoring a higher amount but it is more worrying when you are conceding a massive variety of goals. The analysis available to the management team will be in depth, but just from what I have seen, we don't get done in and behind much, we are ok with set pieces but not perfect. What we fall down mostly on is not picking up our men and standing off them too much allowing it to be too easy to find space for a shot or accurate cross.

    So there are a couple of areas, but surely a solution is manageable. The danger is to fix one or two issues and create new ones. But I don't think we are in a terrible situation in terms of what can be done to improve it. Our defence needs the biggest change though. The other area we need to address is goals in the team. I honestly believe a few tweaks and a bit of confidence and Gilbey can score goals, he certainly can get chances, and Fraser looks like he can also but both have had seasons impacted by Covid. However, we can't bank on that and we need one or two more goal scoring options from midfield. Having a player like Dobson holds that sort of midfield together so there is a lot of potential there for a fix. A striker like Stockton would add significantly to goals, and Stockley, Aneke and Washington do get a reasonable number. We need a few more from elsewhere and when we had no decent strikers we really struggled.

    I would make goals a key skillset in our recruitment (including from defence where possible) along with improving the defensive areas highlighted. We don't have to be perfect, just change the balance so it becomes in our favour. I don't believe it is an impossible task and I'm sure Jacko and his team are up to it. I am expecting, rather than hoping that they are on the case now. And we do have some decent players for the level so whilst we do need a clear out, we probably don't need as many in as people think. They just have to be the right players. And there has to be a strategy and direction of travel.

    Our problem is that we are a little bit too easy to score against and find it a little bit too hard to score. The emphasis is on the 'little bit' and that is why I am reasonably optimistic.
  • MikeBaileysFanClub
    MikeBaileysFanClub Posts: 310
    The Morecambe manager said after the game " We knew how to cancel out the way Charlton play. Our players did the job. I thought that Charlton would change their tactics and players at half time but they didn't."  Enough said ?
  • MuttleyCAFC
    MuttleyCAFC Posts: 47,771
    But maybe next season it will be harder to cancel us out. We want to win, but Jacko has a system and he has clearly decided to keep working on it. A system is a system. It can work but we need some new players to unlock it. 
  • thickandthin63
    thickandthin63 Posts: 2,964
    shine166 said:
    Had a nice surprise in the programme yesterday, poor result but had a great day. I had no idea, until strangers in Crossbars kept asking me if i was getting married lol 


    Noticed the RIP for Bobby Finch,I went to Charlton secondary with a Bobby Finch,a very tall ginger hair lad,good player ,played centre half and I think went into the plumbing trade.I played a few years at British Ropes,Bobby didnt play for us,but he was mates with a few of the lads and often joined us fro training,real nice guy.
  • Six-a-bag-of-nuts
    Six-a-bag-of-nuts Posts: 8,130
    MikeBaileysFanClub said:
    The Morecambe manager said after the game " We knew how to cancel out the way Charlton play. Our players did the job. I thought that Charlton would change their tactics and players at half time but they didn't."  Enough said ?
    I'd love to ask Jacko for his reaction to that statement.
  • ForeverAddickted
    ForeverAddickted Posts: 94,719
    Well we "won" the second half 2-1, so thats surely proof that Jackson didnt need to change tactics at that point

    Its the fact we were stupid enough to go into HT at 2-0 that left us with the mountain to climb
  • rememberbillybonds
    rememberbillybonds Posts: 759
    All the comments about McGilverry being the worst keeper ever not quite true. He never seems to have fitted in but remember Thuram, now that is the worst keeper.
  • ForeverAddickted
    ForeverAddickted Posts: 94,719
    rememberbillybonds said:
    All the comments about McGilverry being the worst keeper ever not quite true. He never seems to have fitted in but remember Thuram, now that is the worst keeper.
    I'd also put Macca above Nicky Weaver for us
  • Callumcafc
    Callumcafc Posts: 63,827
    Scoham said:

    Another xG graph from Experimental 361…

    Jacko wasn’t wrong when he said they were clinical and we were wasteful. Gnahoua in particular did very well to score twice from the shots taken.

    Stockley will be disappointed not to have scored just before half time.


  • shine166
    shine166 Posts: 13,933
    RodneyCharltonTrotta said:
    Congratulations @shine166

    Cheers mate 👍 

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  • mendonca
    mendonca Posts: 9,417
    Morecambe Gaffer has just ruined next season for us:

    “We knew the gameplan and we had to suss them out – we did that really well. We locked high on to their back three, we dealt with their wing-backs with our full-backs, our midfield players then locked on to their midfield players. It stopped them playing."
  • killerandflash
    killerandflash Posts: 69,955
    mendonca said:
    Morecambe Gaffer has just ruined next season for us:

    “We knew the gameplan and we had to suss them out – we did that really well. We locked high on to their back three, we dealt with their wing-backs with our full-backs, our midfield players then locked on to their midfield players. It stopped them playing."
    Jacko got the bounce with his tactics when he took over, but many opposition managers have sussed out how to counter them, hence our results settling down to mid table mediocrity 
  • Cordoban Addick
    Cordoban Addick Posts: 5,448
    What frustrates me is that for their first goal Stockton pulled back to the penalty spot, the player going down the wing new he was was going to do that so played the ball there. This followed the midfielder knowing that the guy who crossed would run into the space that he ran into. Two simple straight line passes with neither player really having to look up. We never seem to do that (anywhere on the pitch) and a ball pinged across the box is much harder to connect to properly and more likely to miss the on runners.

    It also means that we generally have 2 or 3 players stretching to reach the ball across the six yard box whilst they needed 1 in the box to connect on the penalty spot. 

    Hard and low can sometimes be right but we had a number of occasions (3 or 4+ ) where we got close to the bye line and thumped it across, I think on only one did we even make a connection (and didn't score). We don't seem to think or intuitively know where our team mates are going to go, other teams (including Morecombe) seem to have that.
  • Scoham
    Scoham Posts: 37,437
    killerandflash said:
    mendonca said:
    Morecambe Gaffer has just ruined next season for us:

    “We knew the gameplan and we had to suss them out – we did that really well. We locked high on to their back three, we dealt with their wing-backs with our full-backs, our midfield players then locked on to their midfield players. It stopped them playing."
    Jacko got the bounce with his tactics when he took over, but many opposition managers have sussed out how to counter them, hence our results settling down to mid table mediocrity 
    mendonca said:
    Morecambe Gaffer has just ruined next season for us:

    “We knew the gameplan and we had to suss them out – we did that really well. We locked high on to their back three, we dealt with their wing-backs with our full-backs, our midfield players then locked on to their midfield players. It stopped them playing."
    And yet several clubs are fighting for promotion playing three at the back.

    The formation isn’t the issue, it’s the quality and in some cases the attitude of the players.

    Switch to other systems and it won’t be long until the weaknesses in those will be exposed too.
  • SouthWest_Addicks
    SouthWest_Addicks Posts: 6,308
    Scoham said:
    killerandflash said:
    mendonca said:
    Morecambe Gaffer has just ruined next season for us:

    “We knew the gameplan and we had to suss them out – we did that really well. We locked high on to their back three, we dealt with their wing-backs with our full-backs, our midfield players then locked on to their midfield players. It stopped them playing."
    Jacko got the bounce with his tactics when he took over, but many opposition managers have sussed out how to counter them, hence our results settling down to mid table mediocrity 
    mendonca said:
    Morecambe Gaffer has just ruined next season for us:

    “We knew the gameplan and we had to suss them out – we did that really well. We locked high on to their back three, we dealt with their wing-backs with our full-backs, our midfield players then locked on to their midfield players. It stopped them playing."
    And yet several clubs are fighting for promotion playing three at the back.

    The formation isn’t the issue, it’s the quality and in some cases the attitude of the players.

    Switch to other systems and it won’t be long until the weaknesses in those will be exposed too.
    Lack of goals from midfield is the huge concern. If we had someone of Gallagher or Aribo ability for the timings of runs into the box we would probably have been out of sight within 5 mins. Damage was done not scoring in opening 10 when we dominated. Way too predictable throughout.
  • Davo55
    Davo55 Posts: 7,846
    edited April 2022
    mendonca said:
    Morecambe Gaffer has just ruined next season for us:

    “We knew the gameplan and we had to suss them out – we did that really well. We locked high on to their back three, we dealt with their wing-backs with our full-backs, our midfield players then locked on to their midfield players. It stopped them playing."
    And that, in a nutshell, is the problem with Jacko. His system is totally predictable and he either doesn't know how to change it around or simply refuses to. Both the team and the manager have to be capable of spotting problems and adapting accordingly.
  • Callumcafc
    Callumcafc Posts: 63,827
    Scoham said:
    killerandflash said:
    mendonca said:
    Morecambe Gaffer has just ruined next season for us:

    “We knew the gameplan and we had to suss them out – we did that really well. We locked high on to their back three, we dealt with their wing-backs with our full-backs, our midfield players then locked on to their midfield players. It stopped them playing."
    Jacko got the bounce with his tactics when he took over, but many opposition managers have sussed out how to counter them, hence our results settling down to mid table mediocrity 
    mendonca said:
    Morecambe Gaffer has just ruined next season for us:

    “We knew the gameplan and we had to suss them out – we did that really well. We locked high on to their back three, we dealt with their wing-backs with our full-backs, our midfield players then locked on to their midfield players. It stopped them playing."
    And yet several clubs are fighting for promotion playing three at the back.

    The formation isn’t the issue, it’s the quality and in some cases the attitude of the players.

    Switch to other systems and it won’t be long until the weaknesses in those will be exposed too.
    Yes they played their hand very well but leaving their two centre backs against two strikers SHOULD be a very risky tactic.

    Unfortunately Stockley is half injured while also playing like a headless chicken whereas Burstow looks like a lost boy out there.

    They would not have been nearly as comfortable playing the way they did with Washington and/or Aneke in the starting eleven.
  • SELR_addicks
    SELR_addicks Posts: 15,492
    Scoham said:
    killerandflash said:
    mendonca said:
    Morecambe Gaffer has just ruined next season for us:

    “We knew the gameplan and we had to suss them out – we did that really well. We locked high on to their back three, we dealt with their wing-backs with our full-backs, our midfield players then locked on to their midfield players. It stopped them playing."
    Jacko got the bounce with his tactics when he took over, but many opposition managers have sussed out how to counter them, hence our results settling down to mid table mediocrity 
    mendonca said:
    Morecambe Gaffer has just ruined next season for us:

    “We knew the gameplan and we had to suss them out – we did that really well. We locked high on to their back three, we dealt with their wing-backs with our full-backs, our midfield players then locked on to their midfield players. It stopped them playing."
    And yet several clubs are fighting for promotion playing three at the back.

    The formation isn’t the issue, it’s the quality and in some cases the attitude of the players.

    Switch to other systems and it won’t be long until the weaknesses in those will be exposed too.
    The point is the lack of tactical flexibility and adjustments DURING the game when it isn't working or needs a change. 

    Once it's clear that they've nullified the tactic, a good manager makes changes. The Morecambe manager is confused that Jackson himself didn't at half time. 
  • Callumcafc
    Callumcafc Posts: 63,827
    edited April 2022
    SELR_addicks said:
    Scoham said:
    killerandflash said:
    mendonca said:
    Morecambe Gaffer has just ruined next season for us:

    “We knew the gameplan and we had to suss them out – we did that really well. We locked high on to their back three, we dealt with their wing-backs with our full-backs, our midfield players then locked on to their midfield players. It stopped them playing."
    Jacko got the bounce with his tactics when he took over, but many opposition managers have sussed out how to counter them, hence our results settling down to mid table mediocrity 
    mendonca said:
    Morecambe Gaffer has just ruined next season for us:

    “We knew the gameplan and we had to suss them out – we did that really well. We locked high on to their back three, we dealt with their wing-backs with our full-backs, our midfield players then locked on to their midfield players. It stopped them playing."
    And yet several clubs are fighting for promotion playing three at the back.

    The formation isn’t the issue, it’s the quality and in some cases the attitude of the players.

    Switch to other systems and it won’t be long until the weaknesses in those will be exposed too.
    The point is the lack of tactical flexibility and adjustments DURING the game when it isn't working or needs a change. 

    Once it's clear that they've nullified the tactic, a good manager makes changes. The Morecambe manager is confused that Jackson himself didn't at half time. 
    We ended up scoring twice in the second half without changing things around. Maybe we should’ve started 4-3-3 and switched to 3-5-2 at half time. :-)

    The Morecambe manager can say they ‘nullified’ us but in reality we created 1.5 ish xG in the first half without actually hitting the net while they scored two goals from around 0.7 xG. That’s not them nullifying us, that’s us being wasteful as per.
  • Chunes
    Chunes Posts: 17,399
    edited April 2022
    mendonca said:
    Morecambe Gaffer has just ruined next season for us:

    “We knew the gameplan and we had to suss them out – we did that really well. We locked high on to their back three, we dealt with their wing-backs with our full-backs, our midfield players then locked on to their midfield players. It stopped them playing."
    To be fair, their full-back definitely didn't 'deal with' CBT

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