I am usually a big champion of the unsung grafter who you don't see as obviously beneficial but then stats show how vital he is to the teams results. So that's a great point. I'd counter it's too few games to draw that conclusion and I have made a snap judgment on what I've seen, totally unjustified and a bare opinion but it's an opinion forum after all.
I think he is good on the ball. It's off the ball I am baffled by his running style and positioning. He is naive in terms of game brain and the target man needs to be the savvy player above all. Kermogant has a wonderful picture of the game in his head and that is why he was such a top link man.
However, he does seems a smashing lad, certainly a decent personality, and I hope he develops.
So when Makienok won a ball in the air, flicked it on to Gudmundsson then caned it into the box to be in the perfect place to head home Johann's cross against Hull, or when he was perfectly placed to assist with a last minute header against Hull, or when he performed that perfect stepover against QPR for Watt to score, what were your concerns with his positioning?
Makienok suffers from being massive in a way because people expect him to be on the end of every high ball. That's just not possible. Sometimes he will have won the ball deeper, or laid it off in a position where he can't realistically be on the end of the resulting cross. He's more than proven that he knows how to make sure goals flow from all our attackers when he's on the pitch so I'd suggest his positioning is actually pretty good
Bauer £1.12m - Solid star in defence and future captain Sarr £1.75m - Seen him twice so not enough to make a call but he has scored Bergdich £1m - Not a left winger (and where's Bulot?!) Thought he looked good the other day coming on at left back else I would be writing him off Kashi £700k - Again very solid - we are not missing Buyens Ba £280k - If you can't say something good... Ceballos £210k - ??? Makienok £1m - Solid and looking forward to seeing him return soon. I expect Watt is too
I have to say that the general quality of signings since the takeover has been at best hit and miss. How many have come in overall - 20, 25? How many are still here and still looking worth a place? 6 or 7? Henderson, Diarra, Kashi, Bauer, Tony Watt, JBG, Makienok (but he's on loan) perhaps? And of those all but 2 joined this year, and on Sunday it still took an ageing Johnnie Jackson and the kid Jordan Cousins both of whom were already here to show them how it should be done. A lot to be said for the character of the squad that finished 9th, perhaps.
The thread was about the summer just gone, but it's interesting that you choose to broaden it out into an appraisal of recruitment over the last 20 months which has effectively led to our current squad, so allow me to add to that.
1) Firstly there is no mention of how well we have played in certain games since Luzon took over, particularly February and August. Nobody complained about recruitment then! We are playing a very different style to the recent past and the passing, tackling and chance creation is vastly improved. The finishing isn't but that will come - either by the current players improving or being replaced. Over on the thread dedicated to summarising fans views somebody takes the time to add in the Squawka / Opta scores. In the last two seasons we were 20th. Early days but we are now comfortably in the top 10. As it is far too early and the sample size too small, I won't go into detail but early indications are that many of our current players are good enough for a decent challenger. Perhaps the end of October will be a better time to visit the detail? A couple of people have told me that Prozone which our club uses paints the same picture as Opta and that means we are in a very good place.
2) Then there's the financial context of reducing losses and the capability of actually signing (renewing) talent like Gomez, Cousins, Bauer and Gudmundsson who enhance our prospects and can be sold to pay the bills. We couldn't sign Poyet nor renew Stephens two years ago so our club has obviously improved in that regard. Players capable of being in a top eight side will command the appropriate fee and contract and not many are going to come to CAFC, are they? The accounts aren't out yet but it looks like total fees paid over 20 months might be £8M and total received £5M plus any add-ons negotiated for Gomez. If you want better players then that costs more money and there is more risk that an asset becomes a liability. And the club debts go through the roof. We were in that place under Dowie and Pardew and we shouldn't forget that particularly when all of the spending failed to deliver improvements.
3) Part of the high volume of players going in and out is explained by some Liege players who have come and gone such as Buyens, Ben Haim and Bulot. They helped us through a mid-table transition season before continuing their careers elsewhere. The Liege link, despised by some, has gone now. It confused some but M.Duchatelet (and Riga / Luzon) demonstrated an ability to improve a squad year on year at Liege. At least until the point where RD cashed in on five players and the wheels fell off.
4) The biggest change over the last two years is the age profile of the squad, U21 internationals from Europe who could be quite tasty players in the future, plus academy players coming through. How many of the players gone were aged 26+ and are we all clear that the maximum value of a player tends to be aged 24-26. Therefore, if you secure good 21 year olds then you might have something quite special in a couple of years - isn't that exactly what we did in the 90s? The owner could spend more on players from outside but that could well be at the expense of the academy graduates.
5) Let's be very clear: CAFC does not acquire players in isolation - other clubs compete and some pay fortunes in fees and contracts, particularly for attacking talent. Of course CAFC has made some errors with player acquisition but overall they have built something over the last three windows which is worth supporting.:Ask yourself how many players good enough to be in a top eight Championship side will join us when the likes of Boro, Derby and now Wednesday are shelling out big money?
6) And finally always good to reminisce about a load of ex-players. For sure Kermorgant and Stephens were and are good players but they didn't wish to sign another deal with our club. Nor did Poyet and Hamer. Most of the squad who finished 9th were also with us when we were 24th at the end of February 2014. They simply weren't that good were they? Remember Gower, Hughes, Pritchard, Hollands and that's just the midfield! Some will cherry pick examples in order to validate their narrative. Those responsible for the custody of our club have to look at the whole picture.
I actually think there's an awful lot to be said for the character of our current squad led by Jackson who came back from 0-2 down the other day to snatch a draw. We do them a disservice if we are always banging on about another set of players. This and the mindless criticism of some shows the fans in a poor light.
And I am genuinely excited by the fact that CAFC is now a blend of Academy players and young European talent. I look forward to seeing whether our eyes and the Squawka (Opta) data witness a tangible uplift from what we've all had to watch for the last ten years. Much prefer to focus on today's squad because that's who we will support at the next game. There's a minority who can't wait to get onto their keyboard to slate certain players or the club about something worthy and important like cheerleaders?! For what it's worth, my view is that we have the youngest squad in a long, long time and they have shown that they can hold their own so far.
So imagine how good they might be next season and the one after?
And all of the above point towards sustainability, especially the bit about U21 players and Academy graduates. Perhaps somebody should set up an organisation which seeks to preserve Charlton Athletic Football Club for this and future Generations because that's what sustainability does! Such an organisation might seek to appraise the club's approach and the Championship competition overall. And that might gain traction with both the fans and the club?
Something more constructive and a bit different from stoking up paranoia and a siege mentality in a Mourinho style approach!
PS I know this is a long response but I think our squad merits that. It has changed beyond recognition from February 2014 when we were bottom of the league. A few weeks ago we fielded the youngest side in the clubs history in a cup game and won comfortably. Far too many posters cherry pick certain ex-players or facts and rumours to suit their narrative so I have attempted to cover the whole squad including touching on the financials. My piece is clearly supportive of the club which I have followed for 40+ years and I make no apologies for that. There have been errors but I don't feel the need to mention those because there appears to be a cottage industry dedicated to levergaing those errors in order to blame someone. I find life is too short for all that. Blame and regrets will not get us promoted.
Bauer - Very impressed. Reads the game well and should get better with age/experience. Looks strong/fit, has enough pace and is well-balanced. Can tackle and head. Looks to have the potential for 5 goals this season (we shall see,,,,). Very brave and displays a good attitude. Similar style player to Dorian Dervite.
Kashi - Very impressed. Like his energy and disagree that he's simply a defensive player, although I do agree this is his strongest suit. His wonder goal and part assist for the last minute Hull winner suggest that he's got a bit of vision. Maybe the system we play means he is shackled but I think he could adapt to a slightly different role if required. Also think he could make the step up to a higher level (be that with a better team in our league or maybe even higher).
Makienok - Fitness/lack of game time issues haven't helped but overall I like what I see. He doesn't jump especially well with his back to goal but still does enough to make a difference. If we can get enough good balls into the box, I think he will start to make a serious impact. Clearly has a degree of football intelligence/awareness. His defensive capabilities (i.e headed clearances) are crucial to the team.
Sarr - Good footballer but not dominant enough in the air yet for the defensive side of things (looks a tad reluctant to attack the ball and come through to beat the centre-forward). But this can be worked on and I remember Dervite was similarly timid in his first couple of games. His left-footedness & good passing make him an attractive option. The potential is there to be a fine player, providing he develops and learns at a reasonable pace.
Bergdich - Probably suffering from being slightly behind in terms of game time but should be catching up now. Might be a bit one-dimensional as a winger and might be better as a full/wing-back. His goal v Dagenham suggests he's clever enough in the box to nick a few goals (he nearly got one v Palace too). Expect a decent second half to the season providing he keeps at it. Seems to have a decent attitude to hard graft.
Ba - Liked his early performances and there times when he did find a nice ball through, although passing seems to have gone astray now. Had one or two decent strikes at goal (hit the bar at least once) and can tackle. May benefit from a spell on the bench. Another young player with the potential to improve. Hope Diarra can be a bit of a mentor.
Bauer - 7 Looks comfortable at this level Kashi - 6 Ticks over Sideways or backwards preferred option like 99% of our midfielders Makienok - 7 Hold up play good but be lucky to score 8 this year seen to many big lumps that can't score Sarr - 5 Only seen once got given the run around by the prolific Ishmal Miller says it all to me. Bergdich - 5 Not sure what position he's meant to be poor touch but quick typically modern day footballer requirement athlete first being any good with the ball second. Ba - 5 Another sideways footballer and when found in positions of shooting powder puff. Ceballos - 7 Only seen once but I know one thing when fully fit he's taking the corners of Gud
So imagine how good they might be next season and the one after?
They'll all be gone, replaced by a younger, cheaper set of players playing out to an empty, but brightly painted stadium with a slightly larger screen in the corner displaying a live feed of the game from a static security camera with the only readable text scrolling across the bottom "License expired. Please visit www.itsalldoneonthecheap.com to renew your license/activate team lineups and HT scores"
Bauer £1.12m - 8.5 leader. Can we keep him? Sarr £1.75m - 6.5 error prone. Inexperienced at this level. Bergdich £1m - 5.0 behind you! Winger, FB or dross? Kashi £700k - 7.0 potential 8.0 pros & cons. Good buy. Ceballos £210k - 5.0 unless he gets on the weights Ba £280k - 7.0 young enough to improve passing & shine Makienok £2m - 4.0 donkey. Jonah Lomu would worry defences more and would score double.
Makienok doesn't worry defences yet has been involved in most of our goals when he's been on the pitch? Not as good as Kermorgant was on the ball but since he's been injured we've clearly missed him.
Bauer £1.12m - 8.5 leader. Can we keep him? Sarr £1.75m - 6.5 error prone. Inexperienced at this level. Bergdich £1m - 5.0 behind you! Winger, FB or dross? Kashi £700k - 7.0 potential 8.0 pros & cons. Good buy. Ceballos £210k - 5.0 unless he gets on the weights Ba £280k - 7.0 young enough to improve passing & shine Makienok £2m - 4.0 donkey. Jonah Lomu would worry defences more and would score double.
In your opinion, Ceballos has proved to be a better signing than Makienok?
If Bergdich is worth £1mill we should instantly cash in there... he will struggle to adapt to this league.. Others have been OK as a whole, but all need time, even Bauer does - and someone to build a steady partnership with.
Bauer £1.12m - 8.5 leader. Can we keep him? Sarr £1.75m - 6.5 error prone. Inexperienced at this level. Bergdich £1m - 5.0 behind you! Winger, FB or dross? Kashi £700k - 7.0 potential 8.0 pros & cons. Good buy. Ceballos £210k - 5.0 unless he gets on the weights Ba £280k - 7.0 young enough to improve passing & shine Makienok £2m - 4.0 donkey. Jonah Lomu would worry defences more and would score double.
What are these figures ? Bergdick cost 750,000 , Carballos was a free , Ba was also around 700.000
Bauer £1.12m - 8.5 leader. Can we keep him? Sarr £1.75m - 6.5 error prone. Inexperienced at this level. Bergdich £1m - 5.0 behind you! Winger, FB or dross? Kashi £700k - 7.0 potential 8.0 pros & cons. Good buy. Ceballos £210k - 5.0 unless he gets on the weights Ba £280k - 7.0 young enough to improve passing & shine Makienok £2m - 4.0 donkey. Jonah Lomu would worry defences more and would score double.
What are these figures ? Bergdick cost 750,000 , Carballos was a free , Ba was also around 700.000
Bauer is the standout for me too Kashi - next best we've really missed him when unavailable Makienok - all the agility of a supertanker and will be hugely frustrating Sarr - Haven't seen him much so far but OK as third choice CH Bergdich - poor positioning, can't or won't defend, totally one footed and lacks bravery Ba - mostly awful with scattered showers of adequacy
I literally want to punch anyone who thinks Big Mak is 'kak'. How can your football opinions so stupid?
Edit: Have a nice day
You are literally a keyboard warrior then
Gosh it's opinions and BMIK even rhymes!! it's light hearted not abusive.
Thread is called reviews on summer signings, didn't see any diktat that those reviews must only be positive. What is this, Sycophant FC?
Keep positive at the game, for sure we don't want a toxic atmosphere But if people want to make football focused comments on players abilities, can I ask who made you the arbiter of what is allowed?
Bauer £1.12m - 8.5 leader. Can we keep him? Sarr £1.75m - 6.5 error prone. Inexperienced at this level. Bergdich £1m - 5.0 behind you! Winger, FB or dross? Kashi £700k - 7.0 potential 8.0 pros & cons. Good buy. Ceballos £210k - 5.0 unless he gets on the weights Ba £280k - 7.0 young enough to improve passing & shine Makienok £2m - 4.0 donkey. Jonah Lomu would worry defences more and would score double.
In your opinion, Ceballos has proved to be a better signing than Makienok?
Comments
Edit: Have a nice day
Makienok suffers from being massive in a way because people expect him to be on the end of every high ball. That's just not possible. Sometimes he will have won the ball deeper, or laid it off in a position where he can't realistically be on the end of the resulting cross. He's more than proven that he knows how to make sure goals flow from all our attackers when he's on the pitch so I'd suggest his positioning is actually pretty good
Bauer £1.12m - Solid star in defence and future captain
Sarr £1.75m - Seen him twice so not enough to make a call but he has scored
Bergdich £1m - Not a left winger (and where's Bulot?!) Thought he looked good the other day coming on at left back else I would be writing him off
Kashi £700k - Again very solid - we are not missing Buyens
Ba £280k - If you can't say something good...
Ceballos £210k - ???
Makienok £1m - Solid and looking forward to seeing him return soon. I expect Watt is too The thread was about the summer just gone, but it's interesting that you choose to broaden it out into an appraisal of recruitment over the last 20 months which has effectively led to our current squad, so allow me to add to that.
1) Firstly there is no mention of how well we have played in certain games since Luzon took over, particularly February and August. Nobody complained about recruitment then! We are playing a very different style to the recent past and the passing, tackling and chance creation is vastly improved. The finishing isn't but that will come - either by the current players improving or being replaced. Over on the thread dedicated to summarising fans views somebody takes the time to add in the Squawka / Opta scores. In the last two seasons we were 20th. Early days but we are now comfortably in the top 10. As it is far too early and the sample size too small, I won't go into detail but early indications are that many of our current players are good enough for a decent challenger. Perhaps the end of October will be a better time to visit the detail? A couple of people have told me that Prozone which our club uses paints the same picture as Opta and that means we are in a very good place.
2) Then there's the financial context of reducing losses and the capability of actually signing (renewing) talent like Gomez, Cousins, Bauer and Gudmundsson who enhance our prospects and can be sold to pay the bills. We couldn't sign Poyet nor renew Stephens two years ago so our club has obviously improved in that regard. Players capable of being in a top eight side will command the appropriate fee and contract and not many are going to come to CAFC, are they? The accounts aren't out yet but it looks like total fees paid over 20 months might be £8M and total received £5M plus any add-ons negotiated for Gomez. If you want better players then that costs more money and there is more risk that an asset becomes a liability. And the club debts go through the roof. We were in that place under Dowie and Pardew and we shouldn't forget that particularly when all of the spending failed to deliver improvements.
3) Part of the high volume of players going in and out is explained by some Liege players who have come and gone such as Buyens, Ben Haim and Bulot. They helped us through a mid-table transition season before continuing their careers elsewhere. The Liege link, despised by some, has gone now. It confused some but M.Duchatelet (and Riga / Luzon) demonstrated an ability to improve a squad year on year at Liege. At least until the point where RD cashed in on five players and the wheels fell off.
4) The biggest change over the last two years is the age profile of the squad, U21 internationals from Europe who could be quite tasty players in the future, plus academy players coming through. How many of the players gone were aged 26+ and are we all clear that the maximum value of a player tends to be aged 24-26. Therefore, if you secure good 21 year olds then you might have something quite special in a couple of years - isn't that exactly what we did in the 90s? The owner could spend more on players from outside but that could well be at the expense of the academy graduates.
5) Let's be very clear: CAFC does not acquire players in isolation - other clubs compete and some pay fortunes in fees and contracts, particularly for attacking talent. Of course CAFC has made some errors with player acquisition but overall they have built something over the last three windows which is worth supporting.:Ask yourself how many players good enough to be in a top eight Championship side will join us when the likes of Boro, Derby and now Wednesday are shelling out big money?
6) And finally always good to reminisce about a load of ex-players. For sure Kermorgant and Stephens were and are good players but they didn't wish to sign another deal with our club. Nor did Poyet and Hamer. Most of the squad who finished 9th were also with us when we were 24th at the end of February 2014. They simply weren't that good were they? Remember Gower, Hughes, Pritchard, Hollands and that's just the midfield! Some will cherry pick examples in order to validate their narrative. Those responsible for the custody of our club have to look at the whole picture.
I actually think there's an awful lot to be said for the character of our current squad led by Jackson who came back from 0-2 down the other day to snatch a draw. We do them a disservice if we are always banging on about another set of players. This and the mindless criticism of some shows the fans in a poor light.
And I am genuinely excited by the fact that CAFC is now a blend of Academy players and young European talent. I look forward to seeing whether our eyes and the Squawka (Opta) data witness a tangible uplift from what we've all had to watch for the last ten years. Much prefer to focus on today's squad because that's who we will support at the next game. There's a minority who can't wait to get onto their keyboard to slate certain players or the club about something worthy and important like cheerleaders?! For what it's worth, my view is that we have the youngest squad in a long, long time and they have shown that they can hold their own so far.
So imagine how good they might be next season and the one after?
And all of the above point towards sustainability, especially the bit about U21 players and Academy graduates. Perhaps somebody should set up an organisation which seeks to preserve Charlton Athletic Football Club for this and future Generations because that's what sustainability does! Such an organisation might seek to appraise the club's approach and the Championship competition overall. And that might gain traction with both the fans and the club?
Something more constructive and a bit different from stoking up paranoia and a siege mentality in a Mourinho style approach!
PS
I know this is a long response but I think our squad merits that. It has changed beyond recognition from February 2014 when we were bottom of the league. A few weeks ago we fielded the youngest side in the clubs history in a cup game and won comfortably. Far too many posters cherry pick certain ex-players or facts and rumours to suit their narrative so I have attempted to cover the whole squad including touching on the financials. My piece is clearly supportive of the club which I have followed for 40+ years and I make no apologies for that. There have been errors but I don't feel the need to mention those because there appears to be a cottage industry dedicated to levergaing those errors in order to blame someone. I find life is too short for all that. Blame and regrets will not get us promoted.
Kashi - Very impressed. Like his energy and disagree that he's simply a defensive player, although I do agree this is his strongest suit. His wonder goal and part assist for the last minute Hull winner suggest that he's got a bit of vision. Maybe the system we play means he is shackled but I think he could adapt to a slightly different role if required. Also think he could make the step up to a higher level (be that with a better team in our league or maybe even higher).
Makienok - Fitness/lack of game time issues haven't helped but overall I like what I see. He doesn't jump especially well with his back to goal but still does enough to make a difference. If we can get enough good balls into the box, I think he will start to make a serious impact. Clearly has a degree of football intelligence/awareness. His defensive capabilities (i.e headed clearances) are crucial to the team.
Sarr - Good footballer but not dominant enough in the air yet for the defensive side of things (looks a tad reluctant to attack the ball and come through to beat the centre-forward). But this can be worked on and I remember Dervite was similarly timid in his first couple of games. His left-footedness & good passing make him an attractive option. The potential is there to be a fine player, providing he develops and learns at a reasonable pace.
Bergdich - Probably suffering from being slightly behind in terms of game time but should be catching up now. Might be a bit one-dimensional as a winger and might be better as a full/wing-back. His goal v Dagenham suggests he's clever enough in the box to nick a few goals (he nearly got one v Palace too). Expect a decent second half to the season providing he keeps at it. Seems to have a decent attitude to hard graft.
Ba - Liked his early performances and there times when he did find a nice ball through, although passing seems to have gone astray now. Had one or two decent strikes at goal (hit the bar at least once) and can tackle. May benefit from a spell on the bench. Another young player with the potential to improve. Hope Diarra can be a bit of a mentor.
Kashi - 6 Ticks over Sideways or backwards preferred option like 99% of our midfielders
Makienok - 7 Hold up play good but be lucky to score 8 this year seen to many big lumps that can't score
Sarr - 5 Only seen once got given the run around by the prolific Ishmal Miller says it all to me.
Bergdich - 5 Not sure what position he's meant to be poor touch but quick typically modern day footballer requirement athlete first being any good with the ball second.
Ba - 5 Another sideways footballer and when found in positions of shooting powder puff.
Ceballos - 7 Only seen once but I know one thing when fully fit he's taking the corners of Gud
Sarr £1.75m - 6.5 error prone. Inexperienced at this level.
Bergdich £1m - 5.0 behind you! Winger, FB or dross?
Kashi £700k - 7.0 potential 8.0 pros & cons. Good buy.
Ceballos £210k - 5.0 unless he gets on the weights
Ba £280k - 7.0 young enough to improve passing & shine
Makienok £2m - 4.0 donkey. Jonah Lomu would worry defences more and would score double.
Kashi - next best we've really missed him when unavailable
Makienok - all the agility of a supertanker and will be hugely frustrating
Sarr - Haven't seen him much so far but OK as third choice CH
Bergdich - poor positioning, can't or won't defend, totally one footed and lacks bravery
Ba - mostly awful with scattered showers of adequacy
Gosh it's opinions and BMIK even rhymes!! it's light hearted not abusive.
Thread is called reviews on summer signings, didn't see any diktat that those reviews must only be positive. What is this, Sycophant FC?
Keep positive at the game, for sure we don't want a toxic atmosphere
But if people want to make football focused comments on players abilities, can I ask who made you the arbiter of what is allowed?