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Crossrail delayed until autumn 2019

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  • Addickted said:

    am i right in saying crossrail was on time and on budget before sadiq was mayor?

    TFL have already got a massive hole in their budget, this is going to make it even wider.

    Theres a few people on here I'd expect to make a comment like that but you were not one of them.

    If you delve into that website I mention above you will find out the reasons for the delays. All about professional incompetence and the usual arse-covering that stems from it.

    This is a DoT project, dating back to before the time London had a mayor. Honestly it goes back to the 1970's. In that time Paris has built four of these things. They are the RER lines and they were built so long ago that they now look a bit shabby.

    Of course it's not Sadiq's fault, but it's bad news which he could have done without, especially as it's not mainly a TfL managed project.

    In the same way that prison riots aren't the fault of the Secretary of State, but affect that politician's reputation, bad news sticks
    Charlton were in the Championship before Sadiq Khan got voted in. I'm surprised some people on here haven't tried to pin that on him too.

    Well aware of that.

    ROT will be running against him in 2020

    Surely SOT?
  • Still can't get from Woolwich to Heathrow without changing trains!
  • I'm sure if companies told the truth about the reasonable and likely costs and timesclares, nothing would ever get done
  • McBobbin said:

    I'm sure if companies told the truth about the reasonable and likely costs and timesclares, nothing would ever get done

    It would, vultures would make less at the initial announcement of the contract though.

    Nobody minds delays if they are told about them in sensible time with a sensible explanation
  • Will it affect house prices?

    Ask Danny Green
  • IdleHans said:

    I'm sure Carter can give you chapter and verse on exactly why big construction projects are delayed - but it boils down to this:

    There are very few companies that can deliver a tender that size
    None of them want to do it because they make fuck all money on it - they make their money on easy to deliver projects with a bigger markup and margin
    The one that 'wins' the bid only does so as a loss-leader (flagship projects look good for a company)
    The 'winning' company will put a realistic programme together to deliver the project on time and to budget
    The client will throw their hands up in horror and say it needs to be half the cost and take half as long
    The 'winning' company will tell their programme manager to change it. They will tell them it's not possible to deliver the project on that timescale, then change it anyway because they don't have a choice, and the company will build in a slush fund to pay off the inevitable fines that will come with late delivery
    Lo and behold, the project is delivered 'late', the slush fund gets drained and the end customer (in this case, the public) gets reamed

    Source: my current partner is a programme manager for a steel fab/erection company

    How much does one of those cost?
    It gets better.

    Her actual title is Erection Planner and Manager
    Does she have to wear a helmet?
  • I'm sure Carter can give you chapter and verse on exactly why big construction projects are delayed - but it boils down to this:

    There are very few companies that can deliver a tender that size
    None of them want to do it because they make fuck all money on it - they make their money on easy to deliver projects with a bigger markup and margin
    The one that 'wins' the bid only does so as a loss-leader (flagship projects look good for a company)
    The 'winning' company will put a realistic programme together to deliver the project on time and to budget
    The client will throw their hands up in horror and say it needs to be half the cost and take half as long
    The 'winning' company will tell their programme manager to change it. They will tell them it's not possible to deliver the project on that timescale, then change it anyway because they don't have a choice, and the company will build in a slush fund to pay off the inevitable fines that will come with late delivery
    Lo and behold, the project is delivered 'late', the slush fund gets drained and the end customer (in this case, the public) gets reamed

    Source: my current partner is a programme manager for a steel fab/erection company

    That would be absolutely shocking if it didn't ring true with practically every large scale public project being overtime and over budget. Someone should be investigating this and there should be genuine public outcry.
  • Macronate said:

    IdleHans said:

    I'm sure Carter can give you chapter and verse on exactly why big construction projects are delayed - but it boils down to this:

    There are very few companies that can deliver a tender that size
    None of them want to do it because they make fuck all money on it - they make their money on easy to deliver projects with a bigger markup and margin
    The one that 'wins' the bid only does so as a loss-leader (flagship projects look good for a company)
    The 'winning' company will put a realistic programme together to deliver the project on time and to budget
    The client will throw their hands up in horror and say it needs to be half the cost and take half as long
    The 'winning' company will tell their programme manager to change it. They will tell them it's not possible to deliver the project on that timescale, then change it anyway because they don't have a choice, and the company will build in a slush fund to pay off the inevitable fines that will come with late delivery
    Lo and behold, the project is delivered 'late', the slush fund gets drained and the end customer (in this case, the public) gets reamed

    Source: my current partner is a programme manager for a steel fab/erection company

    How much does one of those cost?
    It gets better.

    Her actual title is Erection Planner and Manager
    Does she have to wear a helmet?
    Only mine...
  • Far too often do contractors think the rail is similar to commercial
    They need to factor in non combustible/ blastproof materials, along with fire regulated materials.
    This where they come a cropper, getting the whole assurance/approval in place.
    I am currently working on the media advertising side. Our program of works now looks weeks ahead :-)
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  • Stig said:

    I'm sure Carter can give you chapter and verse on exactly why big construction projects are delayed - but it boils down to this:

    There are very few companies that can deliver a tender that size
    None of them want to do it because they make fuck all money on it - they make their money on easy to deliver projects with a bigger markup and margin
    The one that 'wins' the bid only does so as a loss-leader (flagship projects look good for a company)
    The 'winning' company will put a realistic programme together to deliver the project on time and to budget
    The client will throw their hands up in horror and say it needs to be half the cost and take half as long
    The 'winning' company will tell their programme manager to change it. They will tell them it's not possible to deliver the project on that timescale, then change it anyway because they don't have a choice, and the company will build in a slush fund to pay off the inevitable fines that will come with late delivery
    Lo and behold, the project is delivered 'late', the slush fund gets drained and the end customer (in this case, the public) gets reamed

    Source: my current partner is a programme manager for a steel fab/erection company

    That would be absolutely shocking if it didn't ring true with practically every large scale public project being overtime and over budget. Someone should be investigating this and there should be genuine public outcry.
    It’s not just large scale projects, it’s just about every project I’ve ever dealt with. I had one which was projected to finish in April. I was told to make it finish in December as the CEO wanted it by year end. In the end I was told to set the end date on the project software so it forced everything into that end date. We had some people scheduled for 120 hours work a week. It completed in April, and nobody, not even the CEO was surprised.
  • IdleHans said:

    I'm sure Carter can give you chapter and verse on exactly why big construction projects are delayed - but it boils down to this:

    There are very few companies that can deliver a tender that size
    None of them want to do it because they make fuck all money on it - they make their money on easy to deliver projects with a bigger markup and margin
    The one that 'wins' the bid only does so as a loss-leader (flagship projects look good for a company)
    The 'winning' company will put a realistic programme together to deliver the project on time and to budget
    The client will throw their hands up in horror and say it needs to be half the cost and take half as long
    The 'winning' company will tell their programme manager to change it. They will tell them it's not possible to deliver the project on that timescale, then change it anyway because they don't have a choice, and the company will build in a slush fund to pay off the inevitable fines that will come with late delivery
    Lo and behold, the project is delivered 'late', the slush fund gets drained and the end customer (in this case, the public) gets reamed

    Source: my current partner is a programme manager for a steel fab/erection company

    How much does one of those cost?
    It gets better.

    Her actual title is Erection Planner and Manager
    Does she bring her work home?? :wink:
  • edited September 2018
    TelMc32 said:

    IdleHans said:

    I'm sure Carter can give you chapter and verse on exactly why big construction projects are delayed - but it boils down to this:

    There are very few companies that can deliver a tender that size
    None of them want to do it because they make fuck all money on it - they make their money on easy to deliver projects with a bigger markup and margin
    The one that 'wins' the bid only does so as a loss-leader (flagship projects look good for a company)
    The 'winning' company will put a realistic programme together to deliver the project on time and to budget
    The client will throw their hands up in horror and say it needs to be half the cost and take half as long
    The 'winning' company will tell their programme manager to change it. They will tell them it's not possible to deliver the project on that timescale, then change it anyway because they don't have a choice, and the company will build in a slush fund to pay off the inevitable fines that will come with late delivery
    Lo and behold, the project is delivered 'late', the slush fund gets drained and the end customer (in this case, the public) gets reamed

    Source: my current partner is a programme manager for a steel fab/erection company

    How much does one of those cost?
    It gets better.

    Her actual title is Erection Planner and Manager
    Does she bring her work home?? :wink:
    Course she does, she's flat out at work.
  • Autumn 2019 looks optimistic to me. Work near Farringdon and the workforce there have all but disappeared! And the station looks a world away from being finished.

    Compare that to a year ago when you could hardly move for crossrail bods.

    Something going on.
  • The surprise is it is only 350m
  • MrOneLung said:

    The surprise is it is only 350m

    Could have a red rail bus replacement service for a week.
  • MrOneLung said:

    The surprise is it is only 350m

    Seriously don't think that will be the last of it.
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  • The delay to Crossrail's opening and the project's ballooning costs will be investigated by the spending watchdog.

    Transport officials said in August that the new rail line, which is almost £600m over budget, would open nine months after its scheduled launch.

    A National Audit Office (NAO) probe is now planned for early 2019.

    The project's joint sponsors, Transport for London (TfL) and the Department for Transport (TfL), said they would assist the NAO's investigation.
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-46316587
  • Still can't get from Woolwich to Heathrow without changing trains!

    Will be impressive to do it without a change IMO.
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