Attention: Please take a moment to consider our terms and conditions before posting.

Council Tax - Advise please - Concluded - NOT REALLY!

edited July 2009 in Not Sports Related
Got a problem with my Council Tax, any advice well received.
October 08, my direct debit was cancelled (dont know by who, them or me??) anyway I noticed payment had not been made to them in January 09, so I called them (they had not sent me a reminder) and they said I will have to top up my payments, I accepted this, filled out new direct debit forms and forgot about it. I have just changed jobs, payment dates changed, so I was changing the dates of my DD's, guess what no monies have been taken by the Council. I called them 3 weeks ago to point this out, I told them I cant pay all the arrears in one go so we verbally arranged an over payment. Yesterday I got a summons to appear at magistrates court for non-payment. I spoke to a 'Manager' at the the council he has refused to drop the summons unless I pay in full, I cant afford £1900 so I guess I have to go to court and hopefully the magistrate will see my side. If I had not pointed out that they had not had payment foe 8 months then I wouldn't be going to court. Do much for honesty.
Any help gratefully received, I cant afford abrief BTW!!!
«1

Comments

  • What Council?
  • Not advice, but, if its Lewisham Council it can drag on for years.......
    I've paid up fully but was taken to court as they "had no records of payments".
    Had to dig out the last 3 years reciepts........
    Finally accepted them, but somehow they "were not in the wrong".
  • Bastards....

    My GF had this issue last year and sad to say they forced her to pay up £1200 in one go.

    Sorry fella I know it doesn't sound good i reccomend seeing the CAB.
  • You can mug an old lady and get community service. Or you can miss council Tax payments and go to jail.

    Isn't it reassuring that some incompetant minion who hates their dull job at the local council, can just mindlessly issue a court summons rather than apply common sense negotiations .....?

    I wonder who pays their salary?
  • edited July 2009
    [cite]Posted By: bibble[/cite]Got a problem with my Council Tax, any advice well received.
    October 08, my direct debit was cancelled (dont know by who, them or me??) anyway I noticed payment had not been made to them in January 09, so I called them (they had not sent me a reminder) and they said I will have to top up my payments, I accepted this, filled out new direct debit forms and forgot about it. I have just changed jobs, payment dates changed, so I was changing the dates of my DD's, guess what no monies have been taken by the Council. I called them 3 weeks ago to point this out, I told them I cant pay all the arrears in one go so we verbally arranged an over payment. Yesterday I got a summons to appear at magistrates court for non-payment. I spoke to a 'Manager' at the the council he has refused to drop the summons unless I pay in full, I cant afford £1900 so I guess I have to go to court and hopefully the magistrate will see my side. If I had not pointed out that they had not had payment foe 8 months then I wouldn't be going to court. Do much for honesty.
    Any help gratefully received, I cant afford abrief BTW!!!

    Speak to your bank to find out who cancelled the Direct Debit?
    Did you send off the new Direct Debit forms in Jan09? - If they've lost the forms then they're being unreasonable
    Have you got a name of the person who agreed the payment plan? - They should have made a record on your Council Tax record.
    Speak to the local Government Omsudsman - They might be able to help. Councils don't like complaints

    http://www.lgo.org.uk/
  • Go to Citizens Advice, they're great at dealing with this kind of clownery. Where possible communicate with them in writing and keep records, you won't need a brief in maj court anyway, particularly when they're being such idiots and have a long track record of fail. Also, get your bank to confirm that they set up the DDs and also get the bank to find out exactly why the first DD was cancelled. Again, get that in writing.
  • edited July 2009
    Bibble, if you can, email your ward councillor asking for help. Generally everything gets moving much more quickly if a councillor decides to stick their oar in. It'd help if you'd taken the name of the person that you agreed the overpayments details with the other day, but if you've got a record of the payment that went through, that'll be a start.

    Failing that, log a Data Protection Act "Subject Access Request" with the Council. (Go to their website and search for Data Protection Act - it should bring up a link telling you the specific person to contact). It'll cost you a tenner, and they've then got a certain amount of time to come back with all the details they hold on you, so you can check and request corrections if necessary. It's also a monumental faff to do, and will probably piss them off immensely, which you may or may not consider a bonus.
  • Councillor - meet whoever it is and complain, take evidence.

    Before you get to the ombudsman you have to lodge a complaint with the council itself. Ring them up and ask them for a complaints leaflet and get a name.

    Might be worth writing to the court itself seeking a new hearing date if they have failed to provide you with enough time to prepare.
  • Try to avoid it going to court, if you can.

    If for any reason your case is not upheld, you will also be liable for court costs and the council's, erm, 'expenses'.
  • [quote][cite]Posted By: bibble[/cite]Got a problem with my Council Tax, any advice well received.
    October 08, my direct debit was cancelled (dont know by who, them or me??) anyway I noticed payment had not been made to them in January 09, so I called them (they had not sent me a reminder) and they said I will have to top up my payments, I accepted this, filled out new direct debit forms and forgot about it. I have just changed jobs, payment dates changed, so I was changing the dates of my DD's, guess what no monies have been taken by the Council. I called them 3 weeks ago to point this out, I told them I cant pay all the arrears in one go so we verbally arranged an over payment. Yesterday I got a summons to appear at magistrates court for non-payment. I spoke to a 'Manager' at the the council he has refused to drop the summons unless I pay in full, I cant afford £1900 so I guess I have to go to court and hopefully the magistrate will see my side. If I had not pointed out that they had not had payment foe 8 months then I wouldn't be going to court. Do much for honesty.
    Any help gratefully received, I cant afford abrief BTW!!![/quote]

    Don't panic too much about the Court Date not being dropped. That is standard practice for Council Tax debts. The way a Council Tax debt is managed is very different to the way rent arrears etc are handled. Council Tax debt is dealt with in much the same way as a debt owed to a finance company or something similar. You also have to consider the legal requirement to pay.

    Get clarification of exactly what they mean by not dropping the court case. Because they have said that doesn't mean that they haven't accepted your repayment plan. The chances are they will simply go to court and advise the magistrate that a repayment plan has been agreed and that no further action is required. The magistrate will then adjourn the case. This makes it easier for the Council to reinstigate proceedings if you default. They simply ask for a new hearing and don't have to go through the whole process again.

    As long as they advise you that the case is going to be adjourned you will not get hit with any court charges either.

    In my experience, "friendly" magistrates are few and far between in these instances. If you get into a tit for tat about who cancelled direct debits and didn't sort it out etc they will always favour the Council. You don't want that as you could end up with a judgement demanding full payment.

    Not sure where you are based, but if you are dealing with Greenwich Council get in touch with Greenwich Housing Rights & or Plumstead Law Centre. Both offer free advice and representation in these sort of matters.
  • Sponsored links:


  • [cite]Posted By: Oggy Red[/cite]Try to avoid it going to court, if you can.

    If for any reason your case is not upheld, you will also be liable for court costs and the council's, erm, 'expenses'.

    As long as the total claim is under 5k and allocated to the small claims track an order for costs will only be given if one side has acted 'unreasonably'
  • I'm a councillor over here and this is not too uncommon a case. Before you do anything, do a document with a simple timeline of what you have outlined above. Get copies of all the letters you have received from your council and for good measure get them scanned and saved onto your PC.

    Then email one of your councillors. If you don't know who they are, the council website will be able to tell you. Email just one and say that you have not emailed the other councillors - often people email the three councillors in a ward and everyone thinks someone else is handling it. Explain the problem, attach/include the timeline.

    Unfortunately you will have to pay the council tax. The task is to get an affordable series of payments worked out in writing. (Despite your bad experiences with DD they will want them done in that way, so check every month that it has happened). The other task is to get the court case dropped and charges removed from your account. In my experiences councils do this, but if the charges stay on then you will need to look closely at who is at fault for the DDs not happening.

    If it turns out that you have rubbish ward councillors who don't act then your MP is not a bad place to go to. CABs etc can also help but can find it harder to get access to the council officers that make decisions on matters like this.

    Send a whisper thingy if I can help more.
  • Good post, Brentford.
  • edited July 2009
    I had a similar problem with Lewisham council, well i say similar, i just didnt pay it for a few months but still.
    They wouldn't come to an agreement about payment and went to court.
    I ignored that too.
    Ignored a few more letters and waited for them to pass it on to collectors who were more than happy to come to an agreement of £5 a week.
    Bit of a risk but could work out alright.
    The expenses worked out to £75
  • [cite]Posted By: ddobson_23[/cite]I had a similar problem with Lewisham council, well i say similar, i just didnt pay it for a few months but still.
    They wouldn't come to an agreement about payment and went to court.
    I ignored that too.
    Ignored a few more letters and waited for them to pass it on to collectors who were more than happy to come to an agreement of £5 a week.
    Bit of a risk but could work out alright.
    The expenses worked out to £75

    Jeezuz H Christ.....What sort of 'sound advice' is that dd....you end up with a fecking court order against you ....an absolute nightmare for ones credit rating etc!
  • Thanks all for the advise, I have a timeline of events. It was me who accidently cancelled the DD last year. Ive held my hands up to that. However it was also me who contacted the Council and told them that they had not taken payment when I sent in the new DD forms. When I noticed that they still had not taken payment (3 weeks ago) I spoke to one of their people (I have her name) who advised me to set up a Standing Order (giving me the councils sort code and A/C number) including the over payment (otherwise the Council will try to take the full amount). Because they gave me the sort code and A/C number I am hoping that this will be seen as binding in favour of my over payment.
    Thanks to all once again.
    BTW I live near Gravesend!!!
  • Bibble, has the money from the standing order actually gone out of your account yet, and did you include your council tax reference as your payer reference for it? It may be the case that the money is lying around in the Council Tax suspense account waiting to be allocated, because they didn't recognise your details.
  • No. the first payment is/was to be made on 3rd August as a standing order, this was agreed by the lady at the Council 2/3 weeks ago. Then the summons arrived. I will be emailing the councillor as per your advice. Its one almighty f*uk up which I could do without...I wouldn't mind I just wanna pay my council tax!!!
    Cheers
  • Ah, that might be part of the problem. If you've got internet banking and aren't waiting on cashflow, you could use the bank details they've given you to make a small payment this afternoon (say 50quid) as a gesture of good faith. If your bank does "faster payments" that should reach the council bank account tomorrow, although it'll depend on their internal accounting procedures how quickly it updates the council tax system (best case scenario is Friday, but Monday's more likely). If your bank doesn't do faster payments then it won't reach their bank account until Friday or Monday, and won't update the council tax system until at least a day after that, but will still get there before the standing order does.
  • Why not contact your local Valley Party councillor? Lol

    You should threaten to take your story to the media and cause them serious embarrassment, I happen to be aware of a blogger from the Standard haha.
  • Sponsored links:


  • I used to work in a Council Tax department!

    By issuing a summons in the Magistrates Court, your Council will be seeking what is called a 'Liability Order'. All this means is that you are liable for the Council Tax. Most Councils will be happy to make an arrangement with you to pay the Council Tax, plus any costs incurred in the granting of the Liability Order by the Magistrates. They will hold that Liabity Order and no further action will be taken provided you adhere to the arrangement.

    If you default, the Liability Order gives the Council the right to take further action - this may be the passing of the debt to bailiffs (further costs will then be incurred by you); an Attachment of Earnings Order whereby your employer has to make deductions from your salary at a set down rate; an Attachment of Benefit (if you are in receipt of JSA); placing a charging order on your house (the debt has to be of a certain amount - can't remember what that is as it was a few years ago that I last worked in a Council Tax department and in my expereince was hardly ever used!).

    Ultimately you can be sent to prison if you do not pay, however that is a very last resort and is usually only done when bailiffs have been unable to collect the debt and you have been asked to attend a committal hearing at a Magistrates Court and have not adhered to any order they make.

    A Liability Order is not like a criminal conviction, so apart from having to pay the extra costs, as long as you stick to any arrangement made, it is not too bad. When I worked in a Council Tax department, we sometimes advised people that we would ask the Magistrates to grant the Liability Order, but as long as they stuck to the arrangement, we would write off the costs involved at the end. You don't even need to attend the court for a Liability Order Hearing. You will probably find that several hundred other people have also been summonsed to the same hearing and the Council and Court would be in big trouble if everyone attended! If you don't attend, then a Liability Order will be granted in your absence.

    The only time you would be in trouble by not attending court is if you are summonsed to a Committal hearing - then failure to attend would result in a warrant for your arrest being isssued. As you readily agree that you owe the Counci, Tax, then there should be no problem in the Council accepting an arrangement.

    Hope this helps.
  • I had a row with Medway council over paying their poxy tax.

    They will steadfastly only accept direct debits at 2 different dates in a month. WHY? I pay all my other direct debits at the start of the month without exception and it is no bother for anyone else. I'm trying to give them money at the end of the day (I won't go into how much I despise this grotesque tax).

    They won't send binmen back to clear up the mess they make collecting bins but if you forget to pay a months installment they are onto you like a shot. Pigs.
  • [cite]Posted By: Carter[/cite]I had a row with Medway council over paying their poxy tax.

    They will steadfastly only accept direct debits at 2 different dates in a month. WHY? I pay all my other direct debits at the start of the month without exception and it is no bother for anyone else. I'm trying to give them money at the end of the day (I won't go into how much I despise this grotesque tax).

    They won't send binmen back to clear up the mess they make collecting bins but if you forget to pay a months installment they are onto you like a shot. Pigs.
    Dont use that word, Dazzler's a bit sensitive at the moment ;)
  • Shall I change it to slugs?
  • Carter, it's a way of saving money. The more direct debit runs they do in a month, the more administrative overhead there is, particularly if they've outsourced the processing to a third party like Capita, who will charge them through the nose for each run they do. If you want the money to go out on a specific day, then just set up a standing order instead. All you've got to do then is change the amount it's for every April.
  • So went to Court, number 200 odd, only about 20 of us turned up. I guess they feel the ones that turn up must have a good case so they have Council Tax officers that 'intercept' you before you talk to the Magistrate. Bloke from the council listens to my side inluding all my timelines of events, says he cant understand why his boss wasn't more simpathetic, then says that he can float the balance I owe until next March, which means payments of nearly £300 per month. I told him no thanks. He sighed and said if I accept the liability order they then send a form asking me how much I can pay the debt off per month. Filled it in and sent it off yesterday, paying it off at £20 per month until its gone, a result, a pain in the arse but a result nonetheless. Didn't even see the Magistrate.
    Thanks to all my cyberbuddies for their help and advise.
    Cheers
  • there is Nothing that cant be solved on CharltonLife.
    Glad you got it sorted.
  • [cite]Posted By: bibble[/cite] He sighed and said if I accept the liability order they then send a form asking me how much I can pay the debt off per month. Filled it in and sent it off yesterday, paying it off at £20 per month until its gone, a result, a pain in the arse but a result nonetheless. Didn't even see the Magistrate.


    So you're paying off £1900 at £20 a month then? A right result for you obviously but surprised they agree to that seeing as it's way less than what you'd pay each month if you'd been paying it normally each month.
  • Chris, I offered more originally before they took me to court, but they declined, once I accept the Liability then they told me its up to me what I can pay. The main thing for them is the Liability, I have filled in forms and basically if it does not get paid each month then I will get my arse kicked. Thats Councils for you I guess!!
  • [cite]Posted By: bibble[/cite]Chris, I offered more originally before they took me to court, but they declined, once I accept the Liability then they told me its up to me what I can pay. The main thing for them is the Liability, I have filled in forms and basically if it does not get paid each month then I will get my arse kicked. Thats Councils for you I guess!!


    So basically the whole thing was a complete waste of time and they could've just accepted what you initially offered to pay them?
Sign In or Register to comment.

Roland Out Forever!