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Leasing a car

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  • The problems with 0% HP are that you effectively pay the screen price for the car, albeit over a period. A cash purchase for that car would be cheaper, always, and yes you will get a lot less for your old car as a trade-in deposit.

    I'd agree that if you do have to go down the lease route, it is slightly better to stick with a main dealer/group.
  • So what would happen if my circumstances changed mid-lease and I couldn't afford the payments? Would the car just go back early, or would they take me to the cleaners?
  • If anyone is looking for a PCP on a bigger car there are some cracking deals from Mercedes at the moment. I got an offer of £304/month (10k mileage) on a E-Class 250 SE last week. I think the deposit from me was £3k with Mercedes matching it.
  • fattmatt said:

    So what would happen if my circumstances changed mid-lease and I couldn't afford the payments? Would the car just go back early, or would they take me to the cleaners?

    Like any 'debt', there are fees for late payments and penalties, you could risk losing the car and deposit. If you've taken out a PCP or HP you have effectively paid towards the cost of owning that car, eventually, so you could lose all that 'investment'. If it's a 3, 4 or even 5 yr contract, you need to think of what the future may bring.

    Another word about servicing, for most contracts you have to have the car serviced at the main dealer which maybe very expensive. Obviously to maintain the warranty on a new car, a service with a main dealer or approved garage is always advised, but there are lots of used cars available on leases too. Some deals come with free servicing or free inspections, but the detail is in the small print - as someone else said above.
  • both of my cars as they were new had a free service a month after I picked them up and then didn't need one until they were 2 years old.

    Just remembered, one thing, there is a GAP insurance option that you can pay because if you write the car off, you'd owe the full amount. that was probably the only negative thing, it cost me about £200 up front, but as I hadn't put down a deposit, it wasn't a problem. You don't have to pay it, but the thought of owing 10k for a car I'd had 5 minutes filled me with dread.
  • edited July 2013
    I'd love to lease a car - problem is I do over 15,000 miles a year and that has come down from over 25k per year after changing jobs to one where the office isn't miles away. I saw an advert for a car recently and it was based on just 8k miles per year.......jeez, they're cars & meant to be bloody driven !!
  • I'll never buy again, brand new delivered to your door, taxed, no MOT's, full warranty for any issues (excluding new tires, damage to the windscreen) after 3 years give it back and get a new one.

    I use EuroLease Direct - google them.

    No deposit required! :-)
  • Bumping this.

    Potential new job has a car allowance which i've had before and always just taken as extra income. Now i have a family I need a second car, so am thinking about leasing.

    What are people's thoughts on value vs buying second hand/PCPs etc?

    Anyone got any current deals/pointers towards companies?

    Finally, is a car allowance taxed as income?
  • Bumping this.

    Potential new job has a car allowance which i've had before and always just taken as extra income. Now i have a family I need a second car, so am thinking about leasing.

    What are people's thoughts on value vs buying second hand/PCPs etc?

    Anyone got any current deals/pointers towards companies?

    Finally, is a car allowance taxed as income?

    Car allowance is taxed as income.
  • Car allowance is indeed taxed as income. Assuming you'll claim business mileage from your employer at something like 15p to cover fuel, you should be able to claim a deduction against your income tax of the difference between 45p (Hmrc rate) and whatever you claim from your employer for fuel, so say 30p, through your tax return. If you do even 5000 business miles a year, that's a deduction against income of £1,500. Always surprises me how many people don't seem to be aware of this.
    I can't help with leasing thing though, I buy shitebucket cars.
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  • Cheers, it will be PAYE anyway, just trying to work out what I can afford without touching the base.

    I'm trying to decide between using savings to buy decent second hand or leasing so I'm only using the monthly allowance.
  • The car allowance will go through PAYE, yes, but you'll have to claim any deduction for business use through self-assessment. You wont get that tax deduction otherwise.
  • edited October 9
    IdleHans said:

    The car allowance will go through PAYE, yes, but you'll have to claim any deduction for business use through self-assessment. You wont get that tax deduction otherwise.

    Ah, I didn't realise. I used to do a load of miles and only ever claimed the 45p a mile. It used to net me a tonne of money. Could I have made it tax deductable too??

    Ed. Just reread your post, they paid at 45p a mile anyway so no need I guess. I had a fuel efficient car at the time and made about 150 per journey.
  • Stupid question here, if you get paid a car allowance, is it a correct assumption that you can't count the daily commute to and from the office in your business mileage?

    (Well thats what I've always advised my wife for her tax return, so I'm going to look a right numpty if I'm wrong!)
  • On this issue. I had a lease car through NHS. It cost me fortune. The screen price was £21000 for a Vauxhall Twintop top of range in 2007. For 18k per year it was £390 per month plus I only got 14p per mike for business instead of 45 this adding a loss of around £120 per month at 400 odd mikes so around £500 per month. The car broke down at least five times in first year and the lease had no recourse to a second replacement car whilst in service or repairs. I gave it back after 15 months of a three years lease. I should have paid around £700 penalty but they let me off. Also the car was seen as a perk and so at end of first year I got a tax bill of £600. Lesson learned and back to bangers.
  • JohnBoyUK said:

    Stupid question here, if you get paid a car allowance, is it a correct assumption that you can't count the daily commute to and from the office in your business mileage?

    (Well thats what I've always advised my wife for her tax return, so I'm going to look a right numpty if I'm wrong!)

    Irrespective of whether you have an allowance or not you have never been able to claim the journey to and from your permanent place of work as business mileage.
  • I have used Rivervale and have no issue for 4 years. Keeps the cash in my company...
  • I'm now on my 4th consecutive car with Peugeot on lease. In 10 years, apart from the monthly payment, the most I've had to pay is for 1 service per car and a back windscreen wiper due to a v stubborn bird crap busting the ones on the car about a week before it was due to go back.
  • @suzisausage Re the GAP insurance policy, I too have leased (on PCPs) my last three cars. If you check with your insurer (LV in my my case) you will probably find that they include a new for new replacement if your car is written off in the first year. After the first year the humungous depreciation in the first twelve months will mean that your replacement value will pretty much be what your carvis worth. Therefore no need for GAP.

    I’ve just bought a Tiguan (ex showroom so it has got every toy you can think of) that was five months old with less than 3k mileage on a PCP for about 9k less than the catalogue price and got a stonking trade in deal on my Audi from VW (it’s all in the family...). I’ll never buy a car outright again.
  • @suzisausage Re the GAP insurance policy, I too have leased (on PCPs) my last three cars. If you check with your insurer (LV in my my case) you will probably find that they include a new for new replacement if your car is written off in the first year. After the first year the humungous depreciation in the first twelve months will mean that your replacement value will pretty much be what your carvis worth. Therefore no need for GAP.

    I’ve just bought a Tiguan (ex showroom so it has got every toy you can think of) that was five months old with less than 3k mileage on a PCP for about 9k less than the catalogue price and got a stonking trade in deal on my Audi from VW (it’s all in the family...). I’ll never buy a car outright again.

    yep, I think i was given the fear the first time as he said if i wrote it off as I drove off the forecourt i would still owe the full amount of the car. which scared me so I paid it, but haven't done it since!
    I do get a good deal when I swap mine after 3 years as I have such low mileage too. Had mine 13 months and done just over 2k miles.
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  • bobmunro said:

    JohnBoyUK said:

    Stupid question here, if you get paid a car allowance, is it a correct assumption that you can't count the daily commute to and from the office in your business mileage?

    (Well thats what I've always advised my wife for her tax return, so I'm going to look a right numpty if I'm wrong!)

    Irrespective of whether you have an allowance or not you have never been able to claim the journey to and from your permanent place of work as business mileage.
    Good, I was correct then. I didn't think you could. Am sure we covered that in Accountancy school back in 1997.
  • JohnBoyUK said:

    bobmunro said:

    JohnBoyUK said:

    Stupid question here, if you get paid a car allowance, is it a correct assumption that you can't count the daily commute to and from the office in your business mileage?

    (Well thats what I've always advised my wife for her tax return, so I'm going to look a right numpty if I'm wrong!)

    Irrespective of whether you have an allowance or not you have never been able to claim the journey to and from your permanent place of work as business mileage.
    Good, I was correct then. I didn't think you could. Am sure we covered that in Accountancy school back in 1997.
    You did well to stay awake
  • @suzisausage Re the GAP insurance policy, I too have leased (on PCPs) my last three cars. If you check with your insurer (LV in my my case) you will probably find that they include a new for new replacement if your car is written off in the first year. After the first year the humungous depreciation in the first twelve months will mean that your replacement value will pretty much be what your carvis worth. Therefore no need for GAP.

    I’ve just bought a Tiguan (ex showroom so it has got every toy you can think of) that was five months old with less than 3k mileage on a PCP for about 9k less than the catalogue price and got a stonking trade in deal on my Audi from VW (it’s all in the family...). I’ll never buy a car outright again.

    Is there any difference between leasing or getting a PCP from a dealer?
  • edited October 9
    Rob7Lee said:

    Leasing can work for some, but I still view it as an expensive way to never own a car. What you do get is a new one but depends how important that is to you.

    I’m changing my car this weekend. I currently have a car that was £110k new with an option list that was frankly ridiculous. I paid 37k for it when it was 2.5 years old, and just sold it for £32.5k, total costs (I’ve had for 2.5 years) was £4.5k depreciation, £1400 warranty and £180 for a service (although that was refunded but that's another story).

    So all in excluding fuel and insurance is about 6k or a bit under £200 a month. And I’ve been driving the highest end/spec car I’ll probably ever own.

    Or for the same money I could have leased a Corsa or similar. I know what I prefer to spend time in.

    It is somewhat horses for courses, I don't do a lot of miles, maybe 7-8k per annum in this car, but I'd rather drive a high end second hand car than a lower end new one.

    As long as you buy right second hand, it'll always be better in my view aside form the odd crazy deal that is sometimes on offer when a manufacturer wants to get a new model out on the road quickly.

    You do of course need the money to do so In the first place, although loans are cheap money right now.

    I definitely don't need a new car, but I do want a decent SUV for the family that is more than i want to outlay with savings.

    Your commentary on the situation is almost exactly as it is going through my head, but i just can't come to a decision. With an asset that depreciates over time like cars do, i just can't see the value in owning one, necessarily. But on the same token, i've always seen 'renting' as chucking away money.

    got a personal loan for my last car, but did the numbers for this one and the repayments outstrip the lease cost by about 200 a month.

    PS. sounds like you got a pretty ridiculous deal on your car! What are you buying with the proceeds?
  • Rob7Lee said:

    Leasing can work for some, but I still view it as an expensive way to never own a car. What you do get is a new one but depends how important that is to you.

    I’m changing my car this weekend. I currently have a car that was £110k new with an option list that was frankly ridiculous. I paid 37k for it when it was 2.5 years old, and just sold it for £32.5k, total costs (I’ve had for 2.5 years) was £4.5k depreciation, £1400 warranty and £180 for a service (although that was refunded but that's another story).

    So all in excluding fuel and insurance is about 6k or a bit under £200 a month. And I’ve been driving the highest end/spec car I’ll probably ever own.

    Or for the same money I could have leased a Corsa or similar. I know what I prefer to spend time in.

    It is somewhat horses for courses, I don't do a lot of miles, maybe 7-8k per annum in this car, but I'd rather drive a high end second hand car than a lower end new one.

    As long as you buy right second hand, it'll always be better in my view aside form the odd crazy deal that is sometimes on offer when a manufacturer wants to get a new model out on the road quickly.

    You do of course need the money to do so In the first place, although loans are cheap money right now.

    I definitely don't need a new car, but I do want a decent SUV for the family that is more than i want to outlay with savings.

    Your commentary on the situation is almost exactly as it is going through my head, but i just can't come to a decision. With an asset that depreciates over time like cars do, i just can't see the value in owning one, necessarily. But on the same token, i've always seen 'renting' as chucking away money.

    got a personal loan for my last car, but did the numbers for this one and the repayments outstrip the lease cost by about 200 a month.

    PS. sounds like you got a pretty ridiculous deal on your car! What are you buying with the proceeds?
    Arriving Saturday is an Audi RS6, current car was a Cayenne 4.2 v8 that had only ever been sat in the drivers seat despite the owner from new specing nearly £6k worthy of options for the rear seat passengers. Still had the covers on the rear mats when I bought it! I did get a very good deal on it, basically I used to run a motor fleet of about 100 cars (that we bought, not leased!) so I got to know a lot of dealers.

    You should be able to buy an 18month-2 year old car of higher quality for the same as a lease on a new one over a 2-3 year period.

    Your monthly lease is basically paying for depreciation! You don't avoid it by leasing, far from it!

    What SUV's are you looking at?
  • edited October 9
    Rob7Lee said:

    Rob7Lee said:

    Leasing can work for some, but I still view it as an expensive way to never own a car. What you do get is a new one but depends how important that is to you.

    I’m changing my car this weekend. I currently have a car that was £110k new with an option list that was frankly ridiculous. I paid 37k for it when it was 2.5 years old, and just sold it for £32.5k, total costs (I’ve had for 2.5 years) was £4.5k depreciation, £1400 warranty and £180 for a service (although that was refunded but that's another story).

    So all in excluding fuel and insurance is about 6k or a bit under £200 a month. And I’ve been driving the highest end/spec car I’ll probably ever own.

    Or for the same money I could have leased a Corsa or similar. I know what I prefer to spend time in.

    It is somewhat horses for courses, I don't do a lot of miles, maybe 7-8k per annum in this car, but I'd rather drive a high end second hand car than a lower end new one.

    As long as you buy right second hand, it'll always be better in my view aside form the odd crazy deal that is sometimes on offer when a manufacturer wants to get a new model out on the road quickly.

    You do of course need the money to do so In the first place, although loans are cheap money right now.

    I definitely don't need a new car, but I do want a decent SUV for the family that is more than i want to outlay with savings.

    Your commentary on the situation is almost exactly as it is going through my head, but i just can't come to a decision. With an asset that depreciates over time like cars do, i just can't see the value in owning one, necessarily. But on the same token, i've always seen 'renting' as chucking away money.

    got a personal loan for my last car, but did the numbers for this one and the repayments outstrip the lease cost by about 200 a month.

    PS. sounds like you got a pretty ridiculous deal on your car! What are you buying with the proceeds?
    Arriving Saturday is an Audi RS6, current car was a Cayenne 4.2 v8 that had only ever been sat in the drivers seat despite the owner from new specing nearly £6k worthy of options for the rear seat passengers. Still had the covers on the rear mats when I bought it! I did get a very good deal on it, basically I used to run a motor fleet of about 100 cars (that we bought, not leased!) so I got to know a lot of dealers.

    You should be able to buy an 18month-2 year old car of higher quality for the same as a lease on a new one over a 2-3 year period.

    Your monthly lease is basically paying for depreciation! You don't avoid it by leasing, far from it!

    What SUV's are you looking at?
    Mazda CX-5 and Discovery sport at the moment - but that's based on leasing them. Had a CX-5 before and I loved it, the spec you get for the price is unreal.

    I can afford to move up a class, and love the f-pace and Stelvio...but i'm not sure i want the price commitment at the moment, both possibly too new for a second hand purchase.

    I'm also trying to buy and sell a house so finance, while not tight, is under scrutiny.

    Didn't you fancy sticking with the Cayenne? I've never driven a RS Audi to be fair but that Porsche sounds like a machine!
  • Rob7Lee said:

    Leasing can work for some, but I still view it as an expensive way to never own a car. What you do get is a new one but depends how important that is to you.

    I’m changing my car this weekend. I currently have a car that was £110k new with an option list that was frankly ridiculous. I paid 37k for it when it was 2.5 years old, and just sold it for £32.5k, total costs (I’ve had for 2.5 years) was £4.5k depreciation, £1400 warranty and £180 for a service (although that was refunded but that's another story).

    So all in excluding fuel and insurance is about 6k or a bit under £200 a month. And I’ve been driving the highest end/spec car I’ll probably ever own.

    Or for the same money I could have leased a Corsa or similar. I know what I prefer to spend time in.

    It is somewhat horses for courses, I don't do a lot of miles, maybe 7-8k per annum in this car, but I'd rather drive a high end second hand car than a lower end new one.

    As long as you buy right second hand, it'll always be better in my view aside form the odd crazy deal that is sometimes on offer when a manufacturer wants to get a new model out on the road quickly.

    You do of course need the money to do so In the first place, although loans are cheap money right now.

    I take a Company car but if I didn't I would do the same - buy a high end used car around 2 years old and change every couple of years.
  • There are some cracking deals on late model Discovery 4s at the moment - particularly those with the extra 'packs' they added, prior to the new model coming out last year.
  • Rob7Lee said:

    Rob7Lee said:

    Leasing can work for some, but I still view it as an expensive way to never own a car. What you do get is a new one but depends how important that is to you.

    I’m changing my car this weekend. I currently have a car that was £110k new with an option list that was frankly ridiculous. I paid 37k for it when it was 2.5 years old, and just sold it for £32.5k, total costs (I’ve had for 2.5 years) was £4.5k depreciation, £1400 warranty and £180 for a service (although that was refunded but that's another story).

    So all in excluding fuel and insurance is about 6k or a bit under £200 a month. And I’ve been driving the highest end/spec car I’ll probably ever own.

    Or for the same money I could have leased a Corsa or similar. I know what I prefer to spend time in.

    It is somewhat horses for courses, I don't do a lot of miles, maybe 7-8k per annum in this car, but I'd rather drive a high end second hand car than a lower end new one.

    As long as you buy right second hand, it'll always be better in my view aside form the odd crazy deal that is sometimes on offer when a manufacturer wants to get a new model out on the road quickly.

    You do of course need the money to do so In the first place, although loans are cheap money right now.

    I definitely don't need a new car, but I do want a decent SUV for the family that is more than i want to outlay with savings.

    Your commentary on the situation is almost exactly as it is going through my head, but i just can't come to a decision. With an asset that depreciates over time like cars do, i just can't see the value in owning one, necessarily. But on the same token, i've always seen 'renting' as chucking away money.

    got a personal loan for my last car, but did the numbers for this one and the repayments outstrip the lease cost by about 200 a month.

    PS. sounds like you got a pretty ridiculous deal on your car! What are you buying with the proceeds?
    Arriving Saturday is an Audi RS6, current car was a Cayenne 4.2 v8 that had only ever been sat in the drivers seat despite the owner from new specing nearly £6k worthy of options for the rear seat passengers. Still had the covers on the rear mats when I bought it! I did get a very good deal on it, basically I used to run a motor fleet of about 100 cars (that we bought, not leased!) so I got to know a lot of dealers.

    You should be able to buy an 18month-2 year old car of higher quality for the same as a lease on a new one over a 2-3 year period.

    Your monthly lease is basically paying for depreciation! You don't avoid it by leasing, far from it!

    What SUV's are you looking at?
    Mazda CX-5 and Discovery sport at the moment - but that's based on leasing them. Had a CX-5 before and I loved it, the spec you get for the price is unreal.

    I can afford to move up a class, and love the f-pace and Stelvio...but i'm not sure i want the price commitment at the moment, both possibly too new for a second hand purchase.

    I'm also trying to buy and sell a house so finance, while not tight, is under scrutiny.

    Didn't you fancy sticking with the Cayenne? I've never driven a RS Audi to be fair but that Porsche sounds like a machine!
    For me buying at around 2 years old and changing every 2-3 years is the optimum for value.

    The Cayenne was a great car, from heated and cooled seats, to remote heater, auto cruise so all I ever did was steer and 101 other gizmo’s but it was the right time for it to go. Was very quick and still did 30+ to the gallon.

    The RS6 is something else, 0-62 in 3.7 and limited to 173mph!! Very similar spec although I lose the cooled seats :neutral:

    I’d never buy another land rover, every other car is a Friday lemon! Lease sounds as if it works for you right now. Nothing wrong with it but an expensive route long term.
    bobmunro said:

    Rob7Lee said:

    Leasing can work for some, but I still view it as an expensive way to never own a car. What you do get is a new one but depends how important that is to you.

    I’m changing my car this weekend. I currently have a car that was £110k new with an option list that was frankly ridiculous. I paid 37k for it when it was 2.5 years old, and just sold it for £32.5k, total costs (I’ve had for 2.5 years) was £4.5k depreciation, £1400 warranty and £180 for a service (although that was refunded but that's another story).

    So all in excluding fuel and insurance is about 6k or a bit under £200 a month. And I’ve been driving the highest end/spec car I’ll probably ever own.

    Or for the same money I could have leased a Corsa or similar. I know what I prefer to spend time in.

    It is somewhat horses for courses, I don't do a lot of miles, maybe 7-8k per annum in this car, but I'd rather drive a high end second hand car than a lower end new one.

    As long as you buy right second hand, it'll always be better in my view aside form the odd crazy deal that is sometimes on offer when a manufacturer wants to get a new model out on the road quickly.

    You do of course need the money to do so In the first place, although loans are cheap money right now.

    I take a Company car but if I didn't I would do the same - buy a high end used car around 2 years old and change every couple of years.
    It’s the way to go, if you can take cash it may work out better for you. I do low miles so tend to buy a slightly higher than average miles car which after 2 years is back to average or below.
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